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Post by Shady on Dec 19, 2017 1:53:27 GMT -8
I don’t get the fuss over the word fetus in the context of a scientific organisation like the CDC. It is the correct name for that stage of human development and is not just something thrown around in terms of abortion. A lot of diseases have an effect on a fetus in the womb, and why should the language be changed from what is scientifically accurate to something a politician wants?
It’s sad that this turns into another “well Democrats did this so Republicans can do this” argument. Which ever party tries to correct science, it’s wrong. I just don’t believe it’d happen over here.
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Post by Tumbleweed on Dec 19, 2017 2:24:34 GMT -8
I don’t get the fuss over the word fetus in the context of a scientific organisation like the CDC. It is the correct name for that stage of human development and is not just something thrown around in terms of abortion. A lot of diseases have an effect on a fetus in the womb, and why should the language be changed from what is scientifically accurate to something a politician wants? It’s sad that this turns into another “well Democrats did this so Republicans can do this” argument. Which ever party tries to correct science, it’s wrong. I just don’t believe it’d happen over here. It happens all over the globe that words are banned and I mean actually banned and not just recommended or suggested. ( Washington Post) (I was shocked to find WP had this article.) When certain words are preferred, each entity thinks there is good reason behind it and of course they think they are right. When people are so offended over something Trump did, it is natural to point out that Obama did it too (as well as other countries) to try to get them to not be so upset. Sorry. Personally, I don't think any one should be told what words to use or not use, as long as there is no mistake what is meant, but that's just me. Also, even though most every human knows what fetus means, when a agency is writing a budget, they should not use scientific terms so every citizen can understand what they mean without having to google it. Now that I said that, when I find time, I'm digging up CDC's last years budget and see if they used the scientific terms for all things where there is a scientific name for it rather than a common name. Now I'm curious.
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Post by 📚 Dianne 📚 on Dec 19, 2017 5:02:18 GMT -8
If you are not a Republican it seems that you are going to find that no matter what the President does, it's wrong. I'm a Republican and don't agree with everything our President does, but I learned to live with Clinton and Obama, and they both did very stupid, nonsensical and clownish things, but this is getting to be a witch hunt now. Learn to live with Trump. It will most likely not be a full eight years. Live with it like I did! Now on to the topic - These are not banned words from the American vocabulary, they are banned from the CDC. I'm sure that other words that mean the same thing will soon take their place. Tempest in a teapot. People trying to find trouble where there is really none. Why not be worried about North Korea? This is something to worry about -not a choice of words.
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Post by Mehere on Dec 19, 2017 8:27:50 GMT -8
Not trying to get an argument going here, but I just want to make known my opinion on the fact that there is even an attempt to make a comparison to words being banned that have racially charged connections to them to ones that are used heavily in science today is really a sickening sight to say the least.
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Post by ♥ ℒʊ√ ♥ on Dec 19, 2017 12:23:13 GMT -8
Oh, so it's o.k. when a democrat recommends different words be used but republicans can't? Freedom of speech only when it suits the democrats beliefs, I guess. And for the record, just because you say there is no comparison doesn't make it so. Republicans find it offensive when people pretend they aborted a "fetus" when in fact, it is a unborn baby and if you don't think someone didn't recommended the word fetus to be used instead of baby being anywhere in the vocabulary, you are fooling yourself. And CDC Director Brenda Fitzgerald did clarify they are not banned words but it does sound like they talked about those words, maybe. ---facebook url="https://www.facebook.com/CDC/posts/10155438036741026 You do know that both Bush's are not happy with Trump. When you guys quote a republican saying something against Trump is seems to be from the ones who hold a grudge aka, got their butts beat in the primary. Zealots? Luv, by naming the exact enemy was clarifying it wasn't a whole religion. That was the whole point of why republicans found what Obama wouldn't let people say, stupid. I doubt Obama had an issue saying Westboro Baptist Church and I've seen plenty of both democrats and republicans actually name the enemy (say Westboro Baptist Church) and I do consider them the enemy of our country. There is no question who we are talking about when we name the enemy. If we just say "hate group" it could mean any hate group. If we just say "terrorist" it could be any terrorist group. I prefer people who talk in plain language and don't beat around the bush. Again, there is no comparison. Trump's seven words are not outdated. They are active terms in today's world. Negro and Oriental are not. Both races no longer use them. The vernacular has changed and yes, the Federal government should reflect the proper verbiage. The difference is very obvious. To not update to modern terms makes the government look outdated and out of touch.
Fetus is an accurate medical term. That is exactly what the unborn child is called after the embryo stage. It's fact. Something Trump abhors. It is not a made up term created by pro-choice advocates to advance their agenda.
And what does Bush not liking Trump have to do with anything? During Bush's administration (well before Trump) he chose not to use the religious term because the zealots are such a tiny fraction of that religion. And Obama followed Bush's suit. We know who the terrorists are. No one's head is buried in the sand. They eventually are identified after each and every act, their land of origin and yes, religion are identified. But it isn't necessary to use those words at every single opportunity as Trump does merely to incite his base. It's the very first thing said after every act of terrorism even before offering condolences and having the facts confirmed before placing blame. And when a US citizen commits an act of terror, it's never labeled as such. Instead, it's labeled as as an “act of pure evil,” committed by the mentally ill, always falling short of describing it as an act of domestic terror. So his agenda is very clear.
What you call not beating around the bush is seen as a lack of diplomacy and intelligence in most parts of the world and the majority here in the US.
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Post by daniel on Dec 19, 2017 12:49:23 GMT -8
www.vox.com/2017/12/18/16792124/cdc-word-ban-scienceA bit of an update for this story: the CDC director has tweeted, and apparently internally emailed the CDC, that there are no words banned. Rather, there was internal guidance on how to construct budget requests so that they would meet less pushback from Republicans in Congress. So, this particular incident isn't a Trump/WH directive. Basically, the CDC self-imposed the guidance so as to not to upset the fee-fees of the Congressional republicans by using actual scientific words. A bottom-up restriction isn't much better, in fact it's a bit insidious to the culture of science and open discourse. This is a different story in the light of day, but it's still bad that we have such a large scientifically illiterate or hostile portion of Congress (and the WH).
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Post by ♥ ℒʊ√ ♥ on Dec 19, 2017 13:39:55 GMT -8
We talk about the dumbing down of America.
Now, it's the dumbing down for a party and the WH.
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Post by Tumbleweed on Dec 20, 2017 19:01:25 GMT -8
First, that's a anonymous source again people, from Vox. But you all crack me up. First you are outraged Trump did this (what we get for half baked stories from WP but so typical) and then another half baked story from Vox (an anonymous X employee? Really?) says CDC did it on their own and now you all say it's the fault of republicans in congress. If I were you, I'd be ticked they are being so conniving and underhanded so they can keep their jobs, if the Vox report is true and how they have yet, officially( that I'm aware of) stated Trump had nothing to do with this. So now, there will be half the country believing Trump banned those words.
I'm just ticked I spent so much time trying to wrack my brain why Trump would do such a thing, speculating on possible reasons and I spent time trying to find any story that corroborates WP or Vox.
So I am soooo done with this thread.
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Post by Former Member on Dec 20, 2017 19:12:57 GMT -8
Words get banned all the time and no one cares. As soon as someone says Trump does it,the haters lose their minds
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Dec 22, 2017 5:56:01 GMT -8
Trump just banned the Center for Disease Control from using 7 particular words in their upcoming budget report. "According to the Washington Post, CDC policy analysts were told at a meeting on Thursday with senior agency officials that seven words - "vulnerable", "entitlement", "diversity", "transgender", "fetus", "evidence-based" and "science-based" - were banned from being used in documents related to next year's budget." www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/12/transgender-banned-cdc-budget-report-171216094802697.htmlIn fact, the suggested alternative to "evidence-based" and "science-based" is ""science in consideration with community standards and wishes". This is extremely alarming. What right does Trump have to tell the CDC what words they can and can't use? I know this has probably blown over for the most part, but I wanted time to think about it before I responded. I think "banning" words has a negative connotation. However, I know that when I teach my classes, I let my students know that while words are not banned, they are not seen as favorable in their papers or speeches, unless they clear it with me in advance depending on the topic. I don't see it so much as banning words, but I try and help them think in different directions. It's very similar in my mind to what a DOT does when closing off roads. They can't go the way they want, but they are given other options of how to get where they are going through sign suggestions, maps, etc. Now, if the words are being banned just because a person does not like them and/or believe in them, I see that as more petty than educational. To me, any time an avenue is closed off of from something, there should be other ways to address it. Based on the different articles, I'm not sure if it was President Trump, the CDC, or someone else altogether. However, I do agree that banning words just to ban words and enforce a belief on the people is discouraging.
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Post by wildmaven on Dec 22, 2017 7:13:35 GMT -8
Words get banned all the time and no one cares. As soon as someone says Trump does it,the haters lose their minds I'm not a hater, and I'm not looking at this through party eyes. I'm looking at it based on my belief that science should not be censored, even in the simplest of forms like budget proposals. Once something like that becomes acceptable practice, where then does it lead?
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Post by private on Dec 22, 2017 10:04:09 GMT -8
Words get banned all the time and no one cares. As soon as someone says Trump does it,the haters lose their minds Rick: I disagree with your belief. It has nothing to do with "the haters."
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Post by Former Member on Dec 22, 2017 11:27:42 GMT -8
Words get banned all the time and no one cares. As soon as someone says Trump does it,the haters lose their minds Rick: I disagree with your belief. It has nothing to do with "the haters."
Really? When was the last three page thread about not being able to use an F-bomb in GT because the staff banned the use of it?
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Post by daniel on Dec 22, 2017 12:37:21 GMT -8
Rick: I disagree with your belief. It has nothing to do with "the haters."
Really? When was the last three page thread about not being able to use an F-bomb in GT because the staff banned the use of it? Huge difference between privately owned forum and government function. Also, huge difference between limiting (functionally unnecessary) curse words in official documentation and limiting science terms. Apples to oranges.
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Post by Former Member on Dec 22, 2017 13:46:48 GMT -8
Really? When was the last three page thread about not being able to use an F-bomb in GT because the staff banned the use of it? Huge difference between privately owned forum and government function. Also, huge difference between limiting (functionally unnecssary) curse words in official documentation and limiting science terms. Apples to oranges. As I said. No one has an issue with it until someone says Trump did it. Trump could be handing out $100 bills to random strangers on the sidewalk and some here would find a problem with it. All I'm saying. Don't bother replying because I won't be reading this thread anymore. I've said what I wanted to say and I'm done. I'll be searching for the funner threads in GT now
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