Yale Harvard Game

[Retread]

Nov 25, 2019 17:30:14 GMT -8 Artemis said:

Again, we have to look at protests as part of a greater whole, because it's already been proven time and time again that protests do have an impact, just rarely by themselves (which unfortunately makes them easier to dismiss).

As a general rule, small-scale Protests do little to change hearts and minds unless they are large in number or there is a disproportionate reaction or they trigger other events. Rosa Parks' arrest for refusal to give up her seat on its own had little effect but the organized Boycott of the Montgomery bus system surely did.

Movements are a different animal. The effect of individual protests during the Vietnam Era were amplified by the vast number of protests keeping the issue in the news on a daily basis.

[Derek‽]

Nov 24, 2019 20:34:50 GMT -8 Retread said:

Nov 24, 2019 13:51:11 GMT -8 Derek‽ said:

If someone wanted a tit-for-tat scenario, campus police could detain (but not book) the students for no more than an hour to waste their time as they wasted everyone else’s, but it’s a pretty big group and they’d cry bloody murder about a false arrest (even if it isn’t technically an arrest), complete with a call to mumsy and daddykins’ lawyers. None of this would be worth the hassle for Yale, at all. Besides, I would guess that the protesters cleared their schedules for the day, hoping/anticipating arrests.

If one wanted to 'balance the scales' in terms of time wasted ...

Roughly 200 protesters wasted roughly 1/2 hour of roughly 40,000 people in attendance in that game. So each of the 200 protesters should have 100 hours of their time wasted. Seems a bit much, though.

The time wasted was concurrent, though. True justice requires an objective metric, and objectively only thirty minutes (give or take) had passed. I know we’re only talking hypothetically here, but I don’t think stacking time is the most just approach in determining the value of the offense.

Besides, each protester wasted the time of each attendee. If one protester walked off the field the game would still be delayed for everyone; the game wouldn’t resume for ~200 attendees, so it wouldn’t make sense for each protester to be responsible for the time of 200 different attendees.

Using the concept of collective offense impact, it could also be concluded that only two protesters bear the responsibility: the first one on the field and the last one off the field (possibly even the same individual). If the game cannot resume while any unsanctioned individuals are on-field, then it could be argued that those who bookended the protest are the parties who wasted everyone’s time; time was already being wasted when every other protester entered and left the field during that period. But this is just a fun thought exercise.

EDIT:

Oh, and Derek‽ ...

Go Blue!

Well bless their hearts. That school up north hasn’t pulled off the win in seven years, but they’re certainly free to try again on Saturday.

[Artemis]

Nov 26, 2019 11:07:08 GMT -8 Retread said:

Nov 25, 2019 17:30:14 GMT -8 Artemis said:

Again, we have to look at protests as part of a greater whole, because it's already been proven time and time again that protests do have an impact, just rarely by themselves (which unfortunately makes them easier to dismiss).

As a general rule, small-scale Protests do little to change hearts and minds unless they are large in number or there is a disproportionate reaction or they trigger other events. Rosa Parks' arrest for refusal to give up her seat on its own had little effect but the organized Boycott of the Montgomery bus system surely did.

Movements are a different animal. The effect of individual protests during the Vietnam Era were amplified by the vast number of protests keeping the issue in the news on a daily basis.

They aren't mutually exclusive, which is part of my point. From what I linked earlier (at least I think it was that link, maybe it was another), it explained that protests by themselves don't change a lot of minds; they way they influence change is by getting people politically involved. So it's an important part of a bigger thing. And that's just why I was making the distinction, since if we're trying to figure out what makes a protest successful, we can't just look only at the protest. It's like saying that driving to school doesn't get you the grade, turning in your work does, which might be true, but driving is still pretty important.

[Retread]

Nov 26, 2019 22:38:23 GMT -8 Artemis said:

Nov 26, 2019 11:07:08 GMT -8 Retread said:

As a general rule, small-scale Protests do little to change hearts and minds unless they are large in number or there is a disproportionate reaction or they trigger other events. Rosa Parks' arrest for refusal to give up her seat on its own had little effect but the organized Boycott of the Montgomery bus system surely did.

Movements are a different animal. The effect of individual protests during the Vietnam Era were amplified by the vast number of protests keeping the issue in the news on a daily basis.

They aren't mutually exclusive, which is part of my point. From what I linked earlier (at least I think it was that link, maybe it was another), it explained that protests by themselves don't change a lot of minds; they way they influence change is by getting people politically involved. So it's an important part of a bigger thing. And that's just why I was making the distinction, since if we're trying to figure out what makes a protest successful, we can't just look only at the protest. It's like saying that driving to school doesn't get you the grade, turning in your work does, which might be true, but driving is still pretty important.

I think we're on the same page, in that respect.

I also think this incident has all the earmarks of a nothingburger. It didn't seem like headline news. More like page-three beneath the fold. If this was a one-off, it won't have much effect other than a minor annoyance.

[📚 Dianne 📚]

www.wtnh.com/news/connecticut/new-haven/harvard-yale-protesters-stand-outside-new-haven-superior-court/?fbclid=IwAR0AXyMwrgxhIWoeh2Yl6GELraqglVWG82VEIrHV2VLwzhvzQbKswWMYNDg


"The group of 52, mostly made up of students from Yale and Harvard, walked away with five hours community service."