Groups

[Little Devil]

I don't know if this has been mention anywhere.

We can have different groups that members can join or be invited to join. The only thing I can see is that the Administrator, or global moderator can start a group and no one else.

Lets say that Big Jim wants to start a group for members that likes motorcycles and he wants to led that group, could he start the group but have no power over the rest of the forum.

So how about letting anyone start a group on anything they like and have complete control just in that group, eg they could have the same power as administrator or global moderator in the group but no where else.

It could come in handy down the track if the owner of the board is looking for more staff they could see how each leader of the groups run their groups.

[Mabel Pines]

Currently if you want a member to be in control of a group then you as the admin can make that group and set the member to be a group leader.

That said, I think giving members the ability to create and control user groups would be a very bad idea, what I believe you're looking for is more along the lines of a "Social Groups" feature. Social groups should be separate from user groups if they're ever included, user groups are for organizing members and their permissions, social groups are more or less "just for fun".

[Little Devil]

Jan 1, 2013 14:00:57 GMT -8 Mabel Pines said:

Currently if you want a member to be in control of a group then you as the admin can make that group and set the member to be a group leader.

That said, I think giving members the ability to create and control user groups would be a very bad idea, what I believe you're looking for is more along the lines of a "Social Groups" feature. Social groups should be separate from user groups if they're ever included, user groups are for organizing members and their permissions, social groups are more or less "just for fun".

That the word I was looking for Social Groups

Like minded members can join in have fun the leader have complete control over and it could be use apprentice if the admin looking for more staff.

I belong to another forum that debate politics and the owner made a member a global mod and the member started baring everyone that didn't fall into line with him. The forum lost a lot of good members over him that you could have a good debate or discussion with.

[Shrike]

You could still do this with the normal user groups, you'd just need to make sure that you don't give them any staff powers. The leaders of the groups would still have the powers that let them manage the group. The only problem is that you still have to create each group first. You essentially already have this feature really.

[Mabel Pines]

Jan 2, 2013 4:13:36 GMT -8 Shrike said:

You could still do this with the normal user groups, you'd just need to make sure that you don't give them any staff powers. The leaders of the groups would still have the powers that let them manage the group. The only problem is that you still have to create each group first. You essentially already have this feature really.

It works to a point, then you realize that you have a ton of joinable groups cluttering up your Admin CP's User Groups section. It also requires an additional forum for each group if you want group discussions for each group.

I must say that I have mixed feelings about Social Groups and giving members staff-like powers over them, but if implemented correctly (into the forums rather than as a separate area that no one ever visits like how vB has them, and enough admin control over how much power members get over them) I don't think I'd have a problem with such a feature.

[Ryan Roos]

Because groups can have levels of power and abilities it is up to the forum admin (and those with the power) to create them. We did add new group types to v5 so that admins could create groups for their members. They can assign leaders to the group and members can join, or request to join depending on the type. The admin doesn't have to be a member of the group at all. Essentially what is requested here in this thread already exists. The only limitation is that only members who have the power to create and edit groups may create and edit groups. It is a special power because it is so dangerous, we would not give this ability to normal members. Groups would get out of hand and would lose all meaning. They are designed to be ways of organizing members and assigning powers.

[Mabel Pines]

Jan 2, 2013 9:44:35 GMT -8 Ryan Roos said:

Because groups can have levels of power and abilities it is up to the forum admin (and those with the power) to create them. We did add new group types to v5 so that admins could create groups for their members. They can assign leaders to the group and members can join, or request to join depending on the type. The admin doesn't have to be a member of the group at all. Essentially what is requested here in this thread already exists. The only limitation is that only members who have the power to create and edit groups may create and edit groups. It is a special power because it is so dangerous, we would not give this ability to normal members. Groups would get out of hand and would lose all meaning. They are designed to be ways of organizing members and assigning powers.

I live for danger, it's even my middle name... well, actually, it's not really...

Anyways, I was just thinking about this and the main reason people use social groups is as a way of organizing discussions and interests, correct? I think a better way of accomplishing the whole goal of organized discussions and interests may be thread tagging and tag subscriptions, when it comes down to it tags can be even more powerful and versatile than groups if implemented correctly.

[Little Devil]

Let me get this straight as admin I start a group lets say motorcycles  because a member ask me to start it and I made him leader.

After a week or so the group has 20 or so members and member #4 starts talking to member #11 about BMW motorcycles.


The question I like to know is do all the members of the forum or only members of the group know there is a discussion about BMWs going on. 

[Ryan Roos]

Jan 6, 2013 19:20:30 GMT -8 Little Devil said:

Let me get this straight as admin I start a group lets say motorcycles  because a member ask me to start it and I made him leader.

After a week or so the group has 20 or so members and member #4 starts talking to member #11 about BMW motorcycles.


The question I like to know is do all the members of the forum or only members of the group know there is a discussion about BMWs going on. 

That's entirely up to you.

You could set it up many ways.

You make the Motorcycle Group and you make it an Open group so anyone can join. It gets 20 members. They go to your general talk and start talking about BMWs. It's a thread just like any other in the board. Everyone can see it.

Or

You make the Motorcycle Group and you make it an Petition group so members have to request to join. You assigned a leader who can accept or reject those requests. It gets 20 members. They go to your general talk and start talking about BMWs. It's a thread just like any other in the board. Everyone can see it.

Or

You make the Motorcycle Group and you make it an Petition group so members have to request to join. You assigned a leader who can accept or reject those requests. It gets 20 members. They go to a board that you set up for the motorcycle group, you set permissions on that board that only people in the motorcycle group can access the board. Then only people in the group would see a thread started in that board (and you the admin, because you can go anywhere regardless of permissions).

Or

You make the Motorcycle Group and you make it any type of group. It gets 20 members one way or another. One member sends a PM to another and starts talking about BMWs. That's completely between them, because it's a PM.

Or

You never make a group. One member sends a PM to another and starts talking about BMWs. That's completely between them, because it's a PM.

Moral of the Story: Who can see what is based entirely on where the conversation is happening and may or may not have anything to do with the group at all. If you set permissions on a board to only allow certain groups or exclude certain groups then only people who should be there will be. If the discussion is happening somewhere with no restrictions then groups don't matter at all. If the conversation is happening in PMs then it's only between the participants. It's completely based on what you, the admin, set up your forum to be.


Recap to the Above: This is the same reason above that I was trying to explain that an admin is in charge of groups. They are in charge of organizing them. The admin runs the forum, so they set everything up how they want it (board permissions, etc). That is why not everyone can just run around making new groups. It is up to the admin to decide what gets created and how it operates. If they chose to share that power it is also completely up to them. Because groups have powers like editing, deleting, etc. the ability to create and assign powers to groups is a very special power itself. Only the admin can even give out the ability to edit groups because untrusted members could assign their group any powers they wanted otherwise. So an admin can create the type of group they want and assign it any powers (or none). They can set leaders (or not). They can set the group board permissions (or not). It's completely up to them.

[Little Devil]

Sorry to be a pain in the butt Ryan.

At the moment I have a category for members who want to run their own board eg I have boards for History, Law and Social Justice, Religion etc.

If you want to know what I am talking about here is a link to my beta board

So now I can make Social Groups for them and instead of a board moderator there would be group leaders.

If I give the group Leaders all these powers

Make Announcement: Sticky: Lock: Move: Delete: Bump and Fall: Edit: View Poll Voters: 

Does that only apply to the group he is leader of or to all the board and can I make it so anyone can see a thread that has been started by a group member but they can't reply to it unless they are a member of the group.


thanks a lot

LD (Admin)
(John)

[Ryan Roos]

There is no such thing as Social Groups.

There are only Member Groups.

Powers apply to the entire group.

Leaders of the group and have the ability to add and remove members, accept or reject applications, and block members from the group.

Groups haven't changed from what you traditionally are familiar with. The only difference is we've added types. These types dictate who can see a group and where, and how members join a group. Because of this you will likely not give any powers to groups that are Open or Petition. Private is the traditional v4.5 type group. And Hidden is like the v4.5 group but it can only be seen by staff.

Group Types
Open: Everyone can see and join.
Petition: Everyone can see and members must request to join.
Private: Everyone can see and members must be manually added.
Hidden: Only staff can see and members must be manually added.

The last and most major change is that a member can now be in multiple groups at once. So place members who you want to have certain powers in groups that have those powers just like v4.5. If your members would like a group made for some fun reason then you can make them one with no powers and let them join how they want to. Put someone in charge as a Leader who can mange the group for you if you don't want to do so.

Hope that explains it.

Edit: Most of the above information is available on the member groups page itself. Be sure that you are reading the help bubbles, they explain a lot of things in detail.

[azadmin]

thanks for the help i had problem with setting groups as well as adding colors to the group also

[Ryan Roos]

Jan 8, 2013 9:21:54 GMT -8 azadmin said:

thanks for the help i had problem with setting groups as well as adding colors to the group also

To edit a groups color you simply click on the color box on the Member Groups page, select a color and it will autosave.