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Post by STLUEE on Dec 6, 2019 9:39:53 GMT -8
Big crossover even starts December 8th!. Are you going to watch? What are you the most interested in? I will be happy to see that hunk Tom Welling back where he belongs. Too bad they couldnt get John Schnieder to apear. My concern is they will have too much going on, and it will be a mess. I read this article io9.gizmodo.com/weirdly-enough-the-uk-wont-get-all-of-crisis-on-infini-1840240758How do you feel UK citizes? Knowing not all will be shown. I would wait and watch on Netflix. Ready to see Batman.
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Post by Derek‽ on Dec 6, 2019 13:28:37 GMT -8
I don’t have the time or patience to get caught up and invest in this. I know the Arrowverse is beloved among its fans, but I don’t have any current plans to watch a combined ~24 seasons of television just for this event to make sense. I intend to finish watching Batwoman at some point, but I may have to skip these episodes.
I’ve never really cared for DC’s embrace of parallel universes. In my opinion, it cheapens the stories and reduces the stakes. Why should I care about what happens to this version of a character and their world when there are literally infinite other versions? Or, in the case of the Arrowverse, the primary characters don’t even reside in the same universe, which makes it all feel a bit disjointed and incoherent (yes, I know they have to be compartmentalized for the sake of tone). In the end, DC’s events and approach to storytelling just feels sloppy.
Marvel technically has multiple universes too, but everything either happens in the primary Marvel Universe (Earth-616), the darker, now-defunct Ultimate Universe (Earth-1610), or the Cinematic Universe (Earth-199999), giving events more weight and lasting effects. Sure, Marvel also played around with additional universes, primarily with Spider-Man, which I’ve always considered its low point, but it never gleefully embraced the hand-waving the way DC has.
As an aside, it’s cool to see Tom Welling and Brandon Routh reprising their... er, similar... roles as Superman, but it’s bizarre to see three very different-looking Clark Kents sharing the screen. I suppose in different universes people would have different dominant and recessive traits, creating different visages. Despite what decades of science fiction has led us to believe, if you entered a parallel universe that was sufficiently different from our own, other-you probably wouldn’t just have a goatee or a different hair color leading to you being easily mistaken for your counterpart; you would probably look like you had only the faintest familial link, perhaps like cousins. You might not even recognize their parents at first glance. Hmm. OK, DC, I’ll allow it... this time.
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Post by STLUEE on Dec 6, 2019 16:32:59 GMT -8
I think all those earths are a bit ridiculous. I had even caught a couple of lines Supergirl said to Batwoman that hadn't made sense. Having Batwoman before Batman kind of ticks me off. If they are building toward a Justice League, no sense not to have Batman.With these episodes a person doesn't have to really watch all of the seasons.Just this season.
I didn't care for Brandon Rouths' Superman. I did like his Clark Kent.Maybe I would enjoy it more if I hadn't seen so many trailers.There's suppose to be many "surprises" in the crossover. I never was a big fan of Arrow but as the series comes to an end I will miss Stephen Amals(Arrow) Especially, since the producers feel they have to relace him with a woman. I won't watch the show. I don't like Legends of Tomorrow, I do like Brandons' version of the Atom
Not a big Marvel fan.I like Spiderman thats about it. Thank you for responding to my thread.
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Post by Derek‽ on Dec 7, 2019 13:31:50 GMT -8
I don’t think there are any plans for a Justice League series. The films would take precedence and they seem to be sort of up in the air at the moment with the loss of Cavill and Affleck. The point of the original “Crisis on Infinite Earths” comic event was to get rid of the multiverse by destroying every universe except one and depositing all surviving characters onto the same Earth (which they eventually undid by rebooting damn near everything under the sun every few years due to a lack of direction at DC and overall poor comic sales). If this Crisis is the same for all visual media, and it certainly appears that way, then there could only be one Justice League property. That means there could only be room for one version of it’s A-list characters, and they’re probably going to be the film versions, even if they aren’t yet cast. So... you know, maybe don’t expect (m)any of the Supermen to survive.
Batman’s a different story. We’ve seen an older, retired Bruce Wayne before. Both the Snyderverse and Arrowverse versions are apparently post-retirement, with Snyder’s original plan including Batman’s death at the end of his not-gonna-happen Justice League trilogy. In fact, he would have died at the hands of the villain Darkseid, which is exactly what happened in the comics at the end of a sequel to “Crisis on Infinite Earths” titled “Final Crisis” and led to Dick Grayson taking up the mantle of Batman. While it would appear from the costume design that it was Grayson’s Robin who was killed before the events of Batman v. Superman, that doesn’t preclude someone else stepping into the role. As much as it might seem like blasphemy, introducing a wider audience to a new Batman alter ego might be refreshing.
Oh, and also: HOLD THE PHONE!!! Kevin Conroy is playing the live-action Bruce Wayne on Batwoman?! Kevin “The One True Batman” Conroy? Kevin “Made My Childhood” Conroy? If there’s even a single audio clip of Mark Hamill’s Joker I will lose my mind. I didn’t care about this crossover before, but now I have no choice but to watch it.
Now to continue being overly-analytical, I noticed something very interesting in that video. So, in the pilot to Batwoman Kate just pulls the Batman suit right off the wall and wears it like its no big deal. It’s mentioned that it’s supposedly ill-fitting, but honestly it doesn’t look it. This would suggest it was made for someone with a slight frame. In fact, it appears to be based on the suit Christian Bale wore in Christopher Nolan’s Dark Knight trilogy, albeit with an oddly bulbous headpiece (the show’s even filmed in Chicago, which Nolan used as a stand-in for Gotham City instead of the traditional NYC, from which it gets its name and original setting). Conroy is taller than Rose, but thin enough that it’s easy to buy the idea that the suit would have fit him. BUT, in the shot of Bruce and Kate in the Batcave, the suit worn by Ben Affleck is visible in the background. Someone who filled out that suit would never even fit inside the suit Kate first wore. The upper body mass would be completely different. Just an interesting observation with so many implications.
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Post by STLUEE on Dec 7, 2019 15:53:18 GMT -8
I'm interested in seeing Conroy playing the older Bruce. I am sentimental. Surely they will have a Mark Hamills Joker? I wonder what the other "surprise" appearances are? Also, just an idea, if UK has the CW app shouldn't they get all the episodes? Sorry to ramble on about this. I like the crossovers.Even though I can do without the Legends being on it.Sara is a white canary yet, I have only seen her sing one time and that was on Arrow last year. There is something about the actress I don't like to. Cant put my finger on it.
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Post by Derek‽ on Dec 8, 2019 19:25:30 GMT -8
Since CW is only broadcast in North America, I would expect the app to be region locked, as well. A person in the UK would need to access the app through a VPN.
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Post by STLUEE on Dec 10, 2019 8:56:13 GMT -8
Tom Welling was on for 4 minutes!
Tom Conroy (older Bruce) about 10!
Wondering if I should even bother finish watching.
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Post by Derek‽ on Dec 13, 2019 16:21:30 GMT -8
I haven’t watched any of it, but I did hear that the Fox/Netflix series Lucifer was included in the event, and I can’t get past just how messy that makes this whole thing. The implications are troubling to me.
(I know my walls of overly-analytical, rambling text are probably off-putting, but this is going to be another one. Sorry.)
Lucifer is based on the character created by Neil Gaiman for his Vertigo Comics series, Sandman. Religion played a major role in that series, obviously, as Lucifer is the Lucifer—the biblical Devil—who decides presiding over Hell is a drag and wants to live a life of hedonism on modern Earth. In this series God definitely exists, which means he definitely exists throughout all of the DC cinematic universe given Lucifer‘s inclusion in this unifying event. Hell, God—played by Gaiman himself—even narrated an episode.
(The short-lived CW series Constantine is also supposed to be part of the “Crisis” event (maybe the film, too?). It’s based on the Hellblazer comic series from Vertigo and shares its initial fictional universe with Sandman, so it would also seem to confirm the existence of God, but it’s not quite as problematic in its implications as Lucifer.)
Now, if “Crisis on Infinite Earths” follows the same path as it did in the comics, all universes—literally an infinite number of them—will be erased from existence, except for one. Think of the trillions, quadrillions, pentillions, or so sentient lives that must live in a single universe that would be killed... then multiply that an infinite number of times. There are literally an infinite number of people being killed by this event. An infinite number of God’s creations are being erased from existence and he doesn’t care enough to stop it. Perhaps he even had a hand in it? That’s messed up on many levels.
This implication is even worse when you consider God is depicted as being closer to benevolent in the comics. There, Lucifer learns that he was granted dominion over Hell not as a punishment, but as a gift out of love. God knows Lucifer has a deep, passionate hatred for him and Hell is the farthest possible location from God, so that’s the best gift he could bestow. On TV, Lucifer is depicted as less of a character with a mature ideology on anything and more of a spoiled rich kid who never had to be accountable for any of his deeds, but is slowly learning a sense of human morality. He also has a paranoid notion that God micromanages his life and is constantly subjecting him to mind games for some twisted plan, when it’s probably more of an unwanted redemption.
Comics and superheroes work best when they’re atheistic. They go to pretty wild extremes in storytelling that would be very troubling in real life, so it’s easier if a sense of faith is omitted and the tough questions are never asked. I’m not saying these stories should be overtly anti-theistic or assert definitively the lack of gods, but some characters and events are just harder to square away with mainstream western religious iconography and philosophy. It’s weird enough for Superman to be present in the heart of the Protestant Christian world and not have religious institutions (or society as a whole) change to any special degree, but it’s unfathomable that Superman would then try to prevent the erasure of everything in existence only to have God sit by and say “good luck” with a shoulder shrug. It calls his entire characterization into question. He shouldn’t be a character.
(Note: Vertigo was an imprint of DC and had a separate, darker shared universe for its characters. It was perfect for religious-themed stories. DC has since closed Vertigo and added all of its combined characters into the same universe... kind of. Sure, Constantine and Lucifer might technically co-exist with the likes of Batman, but they were added long after the “Crisis” event in the comics. DC has since rebooted and fractured its universes several times since.)
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🍁🇨🇦 Tai Pan 🇨🇦🍁
"If you don't like the cops, next time you're in danger, call a protester..."
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Post by 🍁🇨🇦 Tai Pan 🇨🇦🍁 on Dec 14, 2019 6:13:13 GMT -8
I hate this cross over crap so I watch the show that I like and never go searching for the other parts. Besides the Flash which I use to watch went to another station which I would have to subscribe to and I aint doing that.
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Post by STLUEE on Dec 16, 2019 16:42:41 GMT -8
I could see one show crossing over all of them is too much! Flash is still on CW I'm glad of that.I won't miss Arrow. I wish they would take off that awful Legends of tomorrow. The best thing on that show is the Atom, and with Brandon Routh leaving it will be even worst.I dont like Batwoman. Supergirl is ok. Maybe there is too many superheros on at one time.
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