John Legend defends updated "Baby, It's Cold Outside" lyrics

[angeldeb82]

Grammy Award-winning singer John Legend is defending his efforts to revamp the lyrics to the classic Christmas song “Baby, It’s Cold Outside” to make it more appropriate for the “Me Too” era.

“The song was supposed to be silly,” Legend said in an interview with The Guardian published Sunday. “It wasn’t supposed to be preachy at all. I never disparaged the old version.”

The 1944 duet features an unrelenting man trying to convince a woman to stay the night because of bad weather, despite her repeatedly saying "no" and trying to leave.

"Say, what's in this drink?" the female vocalist asks at one point.

The original was written by Frank Loesser and went on to win the Academy Award for “Best Original Song” in the film “Neptune’s Daughter.”

Legend modernized the lyrics with comedian Natasha Rothwell of HBO's "Insecure," singing the new version with his fellow coach on "The Voice," Kelly Clarkson.

Clarkson now sings “I’ve got to go away,” to which Legend responds, “I can call you a ride.”

Other changes include Clarkson singing “what will my friends think,” and Legend replying, “I think they should rejoice.”

“If I have one more drink?” she continues.

“It’s your body, and your choice,” he answers.

The lyrics of “Baby, It’s Cold Outside” have been scrutinized in recent years following the #MeToo and #TimesUp movements against sexual assault and sexual harassment over concerns it contained predatory undertones.

Legend called the controversy "interesting."

"People thinking we’ve gone too far speaking up for a woman’s right to not get raped or sexually harassed, when some would argue we’ve not gone far enough, when we have an admitted sexual assailant in the highest office in the land. People think that because some people have lost their jobs, or have been expelled from Hollywood, like [Harvey] Weinstein, that we’ve gone too far. I don’t agree. But people wanted the 'Baby It’s Cold Outside' war to be a proxy war for all that.”

Last year, the Christmas classic was removed from the holiday playlist of at least one radio station following complaints.

Susan Loesser, Frank Loesser's daughter, responded at the time by saying that her father would be "furious" over the move.

“Way before 'Me Too,' I would hear from time to time people call it a date rape song,” she told NBC News. “I would get annoyed because it’s a song my father wrote for him and my mother to sing at parties.”

“People used to say ‘what’s in this drink’ as a joke,” she argued. “You know, this drink is going straight to my head so what’s in this drink? Back then it didn’t mean 'you drugged me.'”

The daughter of actor Dean Martin, whose 1959 rendition of the tune is now a winter staple, recently accused Legend of actually making the song “more sexual” by changing the words.

"I think what he's done is, he's stealing the thunder from Frank Loesser's song and from my dad. He should write his own song if he doesn't like this one, but don't change the lyrics. It's a classic, perfect song," Deana Martin told Good Morning Britain last month.

Legend quipped in the interview with The Guardian that he is still giving Loesser credit with his rendition.

“And, by the way, the original writer, or his family, gets paid for my version, too,” he said.

thehill.com/blogs/in-the-know/in-the-know/473931-john-legend-responds-to-backlash-over-updated-baby-its-cold

BTW, this story was published eight days ago, so do you still like the original or the revamped version better?  Oh, almost forgot, here's the video for this song:

[Retread]

Forget #MeToo. We need start a #HeToo movement to crack down on women and their sexual harassment.

[bigballofyarn]

In 1944, Frank Loesser wrote "Baby, it's Cold Outside" to sing with his wife, Lynn Garland at a housewarming party.  It was written to indicate to their house guests that it was time to leave. Further, "what's in this drink" was a common expression at the time. This song was never about date rape, drugs, or violating a woman. The new version is so ludicrous that it sounds like they are mocking the only thing they are trying to defend.

[daniel]

New version sounds too try-hard. The old one has been badly misinterpreted by people who don't know history or the context of that era. It's basically a young woman who wants to spend a romantic evening with her boyfriend, lamenting about how society may judge her. The man in the song isn't taking advantage of her, he's playing along and giving suggestions.

The situation and the song being a radio hit at the time were progressive. Generations later people twist it but she's a hero of female self determination.

[📚 Dianne 📚]

I remember hearing about what this generation thinks about this song and thinking to myself that this takes political correctness to an extreme degree. Can nobody of this generation or the one before it, remember that there is generally a history of some kind behind some of these suggestive songs?


 


bigballofyarn -I never knew that...cool.

[Derek‽]

Dec 19, 2019 5:20:00 GMT -8 📚 Dianne 📚 said:

I remember hearing about what this generation thinks about this song and thinking to myself that this takes political correctness to an extreme degree. Can nobody of this generation or the one before it, remember that there is generally a history of some kind behind some of these suggestive songs?

lol, yes. But can the older generations realize that times change? That attitudes of acceptable behavior change? That the interpretations of phrases change based on applicable context? Do the boomers possess even the modicum of self-awareness needed to see the hypocrisy of trying (and failing) for decades to get music, films, and video games censored/banned and then being outraged when media they find innocuous is criticized as inappropriate?

What the lyrics meant when the song was first written is less relevant than how an audience will interpret those same lyrics today. In an era in which the issues of rape and sexual harassment are at the fore, any popular media that sounds like it’s promoting or normalizing that behavior is going to come under scrutiny, especially when it’s passed off as a “wholesome” holiday song. The song doesn’t give off the same vibe today as it was originally intended to back when the dinosaurs roamed the planet. It isn’t an example of political correctness run amok, it’s an example of a change in values—you know, the thing those same dinosaurs insist the youth of today lack.

A coy game of pretending you don’t want it, making excuses and blaming the alcohol is cute, but in light of events within the past few years young people are generally encouraged to give and seek clear signals of enthusiasm. Through a modern lens, we see a Ho Ho Hussy refusing to own her sexuality and cooking up constant excuses for her intended behavior (a red flag for any man) and a dirtbag refusing to accept “no” for an answer and continually undressing her as she attempts to leave (in the film; a major red flag for any woman). Again, it might have been all in good fun and playful, but it’s going to be criticized when there’s a push for members of society to be better than they were in the past and this song almost perfectly encapsulates the problems young people are being taught to avoid.

It isn’t always on younger generations to understand the past and just give it a pass. Older generations need to make the effort to understand the present and the future, as well. Changes are a result of what came before, for better or worse. No one benefits by being a reactionary.

[Retread]

Dec 19, 2019 14:45:22 GMT -8 Derek‽ said:

Dec 19, 2019 5:20:00 GMT -8 📚 Dianne 📚 said:

I remember hearing about what this generation thinks about this song and thinking to myself that this takes political correctness to an extreme degree. Can nobody of this generation or the one before it, remember that there is generally a history of some kind behind some of these suggestive songs?

lol, yes. But can the older generations realize that times change? That attitudes of acceptable behavior change? That the interpretations of phrases change based on applicable context? Do the boomers possess even the modicum of self-awareness needed to see the hypocrisy of trying (and failing) for decades to get music, films, and video games censored/banned and then being outraged when media they find innocuous is criticized as inappropriate?

Both of these posts fall flat on their faces due to generational stereotyping.

It's fallacy to indict an entire generation for the attitudes and actions of individuals or specific groups.

Unless you can point to specific individuals or groups who were on board with censoring/banning and now are outraged by the SJWs and certain factions within the media, you can't actually claim hypocrisy.

[Derek‽]

Dec 19, 2019 16:37:02 GMT -8 Retread said:

Dec 19, 2019 14:45:22 GMT -8 Derek‽ said:

lol, yes. But can the older generations realize that times change? That attitudes of acceptable behavior change? That the interpretations of phrases change based on applicable context? Do the boomers possess even the modicum of self-awareness needed to see the hypocrisy of trying (and failing) for decades to get music, films, and video games censored/banned and then being outraged when media they find innocuous is criticized as inappropriate?

Both of these posts fall flat on their faces due to generational stereotyping.

It's fallacy to indict an entire generation for the attitudes and actions of individuals or specific groups.

Unless you can point to specific individuals or groups who were on board with censoring/banning and now are outraged by the SJWs and certain factions within the media, you can't actually claim hypocrisy.

*slow clap*

Congratulations, you‘ve managed to simultaneously identify the point and somehow miss it entirely. I thought countering a reactionary stereotype with an even more abrasive stereotype might have been just a wee bit too subtle as a tool of rhetoric, so thank the heavens someone was here to explain it.

[Retread]

Dec 20, 2019 0:22:40 GMT -8 Derek‽ said:

Dec 19, 2019 16:37:02 GMT -8 Retread said:

Both of these posts fall flat on their faces due to generational stereotyping.

It's fallacy to indict an entire generation for the attitudes and actions of individuals or specific groups.

Unless you can point to specific individuals or groups who were on board with censoring/banning and now are outraged by the SJWs and certain factions within the media, you can't actually claim hypocrisy.

*slow clap*

Congratulations, you‘ve managed to simultaneously identify the point and somehow miss it entirely. I thought countering a reactionary stereotype with an even more abrasive stereotype might have been just a wee bit too subtle as a tool of rhetoric, so thank the heavens someone was here to explain it.

Ah, you meant to do that.

[📚 Dianne 📚]

Dec 19, 2019 16:37:02 GMT -8 Retread said:

Dec 19, 2019 14:45:22 GMT -8 Derek‽ said:

lol, yes. But can the older generations realize that times change? That attitudes of acceptable behavior change? That the interpretations of phrases change based on applicable context? Do the boomers possess even the modicum of self-awareness needed to see the hypocrisy of trying (and failing) for decades to get music, films, and video games censored/banned and then being outraged when media they find innocuous is criticized as inappropriate?

Both of these posts fall flat on their faces due to generational stereotyping.

It's fallacy to indict an entire generation for the attitudes and actions of individuals or specific groups.

Unless you can point to specific individuals or groups who were on board with censoring/banning and now are outraged by the SJWs and certain factions within the media, you can't actually claim hypocrisy.

Unfortunately "generational stereotyping" can be a horrible thing for the Boomers...since so may of the hipster's (or whatever they are calling themselves)   wish we where dead so they can clean up the messes WE have left.  Funny how they just don't understand that each generation leaves their own mess and I can see this generation mess coming a mile away.  Those of us from the very late 50's were taught one very important thing, and that was to respect everyone, not this bullshirt of 'I'll respect  you if you respect me first'.  How the hell does that even work???

At any rate I think the fact that the generation('s) after me wanting me and mine dead gives me the right to color my opinion. Sure times change to suit those who are living in the now... but it would help if the changes were for something important and not something like a song who nobody even listens to anymore. It might also be nice if these generation's built up a tougher hide and stopped being (to coin an old phrase) special snowflakes that are insulted,  demeaned, and hurt by the barest twitch of an eyelash (or song lyrics, celebration day's or statues...)

You two think you are so cool for trying to shame me...I have a tougher hide than that believe me, so I'll forgive both of you.

[Derek‽]

Oh lord, one of the most melodramatic people to ever grace GT with their presence overreacts once again, claims people want to see them dead, and has the audacity to claim that they have a tough hide. Hilarity ensues. People with tough hides don’t have victim complexes, just an FYI. Nor do they feel the need to make that claim.

Nobody wants to see the boomers dead, the younger generations just want them to take responsibility and grow the hell up. Stop whining about not getting respect and make the continuous effort to earn it, because that’s how it works: respect isn’t a lump-sum payment that you get once you reach a certain age and have free rein to do or say anything you please forever after; it’s a currency in the social economy that has to be constantly accrued and can easily be lost through poor investments.

I shouldn’t have to clarify this, yet I do: this is all in the “boomer is a mindset” context. There are plenty of older people out there who get respect, because they earn it. They understand that not everything is an attack on them. They understand that there have been missteps or just a change in values and they acknowledge it. They don’t seethe with entitlement and resentment when someone younger expresses reservations or a different worldview. If you don’t feel like you’re respected, it’s because you didn’t earn it. Or maybe you did, once, but you opened your mouth one too many times and flushed it all away. Social currency can be precarious like that. “You either die a hero or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain.”

I don’t know anyone offended by the (original) song in question (Legend’s version is only offensive to good taste for its horrible attempt at rhyming). It’s simply being criticized for the fact that what it portrays can easily be misconstrued. It isn’t (often) played anymore because radio stations decided to stop playing it, sending the boom boom crowd into a meltdown about political correctness.

We’d love to discuss something more important. How about climate change? Ecology’s pretty important. Oh, can’t do that without attracting asinine claims that the “flower children” were the real climate warriors who did real work back in the day and no one younger should ever remind them of their obvious failure pollution, because they already know it exists. I guess the world’s just fine, so time to start giving these guys all the credit, lest they have a meltdown (like the ice caps)... again.

[T.C.]

Respect by people has to be earned? What a load of Horse Crap!! Respect towards people is taught, not earned. Obviously that doesnt happen in some houses. Businesses, brands etc.. earn respect. I'd hate to go through life not respecting anyone I meet until they prove they're worthy of it. Thankfully I'm Gen X and was taught not to be arrogant and self centered.

[Derek‽]

Common courtesy is given, true respect is earned. It’s not particularly difficult to earn, but it’s even easier to lose.

Respect is like sex. Whining about not getting it is the best way to ensure you never do.

[📚 Dianne 📚]

What you and yours perceive as melodrama is not to me...I've seen these sorts of posts and it hurts. Just because you have not, does not make it any less hurtful.

And the beauty of this world is that I have the absolute right to disagree with others' opinions and I have no need to make them feel ashamed of how they feel or see things. And yes after putting up with you and yours -I do consider myself to have a tough hide because I am not treating you the way you treat me -although it IS tempting; I am the bigger person.

Frankly, the boomers have done everything they needed to change the world for the times and yes I think we have a right to brag, to a point.

But nowadays, win or lose everyone gets a trophy just for participating!!! (cool changes huh?)


Merry Christmas. Oh wait, I can't say that anymore can I? I need to be politically correct --- Happy Holidays. See, I can keep up with the times!!!

[Retread]

Dec 22, 2019 14:02:12 GMT -8 T.C. said:

Respect by people has to be earned? What a load of Horse Crap!! Respect towards people is taught, not earned. Obviously that doesnt happen in some houses. Businesses, brands etc.. earn respect. I'd hate to go through life not respecting anyone I meet until they prove they're worthy of it. Thankfully I'm Gen X and was taught not to be arrogant and self centered.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. But this is just the beginning of the story. What should we teach about respect toward others?

1 - The concept: 'Respect is earned' is inherently flawed. While it is valid when we consider how we should talk and act, it fails miserably when we decide whether or not to respect someone else.

2 - By default, people deserve respect. They might forfeit the respect they are due, by their words or actions. But their slate starts with them deserving respect before they say or do anything at all.

3 - We can only directly control who we choose to respect. We can't demand or dictate whether others respect us. However, we can and should talk and act in ways that make us worthy of the respect we are due.

4 - No one is perfect and mistakes will be made. We should be quick to forgive others and even quicker to make amends for our own transgressions.

... but that's just my opinion. YMMV.