[Debate] Staff Abusing Powers

[olala]

Indeed dood:)same clue rite above mi post:3
:)dood

[Former Member]

Hi,

I too have been on a proboards forum with admins abusing their powers, but considerably they do have the right to move a thread lock them, or something like that but I don't think they should ban you for posting in the wrong section now that is incredibly stupid. I eventually got tired of the staff of the forum doing stupid things and abusing their powers I decided to create my own forum which is now located at www.kotor-galaxies.proboards.com and not abuse my powers and only giving my staff powers I know they won't abuse like only accepting members and editing posts due to terrible past experiences with that kind of stuff. I control mainly everything, but when I am not available is a different story. I totally agree with all of you.

[olala]

uh i like hows your star background
:)dood

[Former Member]

Awesome.

[Himms]

Jun 20, 2013 17:42:23 GMT -8 Lethallan said:

I believe that when you become a staff member no matter what position you are. You should always be unbiased when it comes to certain things a member does. If the member follows the rules, great, they should be left alone by the staff team. But, if they over step, then a simple warning to remind them. You don't have to be bossy to get people to respect you.

As for members talking about a subject that a staff member might not agree with. Oh well. That is not grounds to delete the members post or thread. As I said, I believe staff members should be unbiased on all subjects. It's just childish to ban, delete members, or post when they don't agree with you on certain things. Yes, staff members are human and get angry just like the rest of us, but that does not make them better than the members. Members make up your site. For staff members to bash members is senseless. It would be like a band, tv show, ect, to bash their fans and expect them to still hang around. 

I apologize if I seem angry. lol
It's just that I don't understand why a staff member of any position would be cruel to the backbone of their site. And, I have been on a site awhile back where nothing I did was right. It was frustrating. I didn't even get to role play on their site cause they kept picking at my character template. I don't mind someone pointing out I did something wrong, but just nit picking at something just cause you can. Is childish.

Eh, to me. A staff position means you take care of your members if you can.
You help those that need it and your unbiased at issues they talk about. ^.^;

I had this recently, I won't say the admin in question abused the powers, yet the admin threw a warning my way for god-modding, power gaming (I didn't know what power gaming was till recently; and a RP I came from was in fact a power gaming) and for being a pest, without hearing my side, then tell me afterwards that I blew my chances of telling, when in fact, no one asked me beforehand. I didn't even know what the problem was to start with. Or even the fact any member had a problem with me.  Naive? Maybe!

Simply cos another player decided they had enough of how I RPed and the fact she felt I was 'forcing' her do stuff she didn't want to, since I made things 'up' for the players character and mine past(They were each others exes BTW). Maybe it's me....but I don't see how that was god-modding. O.o If it was, someone should have told me. (Mind you, I have only been part of three RP's in the 8 years I have been RPing.....) 

Given the player and myself spend hours in IM, playing or plotting for the said charries.

Needless to say, I left.

[littlebabe322]

When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum?
Definitely when said staff member has played favorites and newer members can tell that they are playing favorites. It makes said new members not want to join the forum, and eventually it'll make the forum die or go south because of such acts. Another thing is when they tend to stick to groups basically like cliques in a High School.

Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning?
I say definitely warning first and the banning will be depending on what they have done. If the staff member goes straight to banning then that's definitely abusing the powers.

What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs?
That's basically like harassment and it's also not letting members express their own opinion. The staff member would be basically brainwashing them into thinking that there's one or no way type of thing.

What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?
I don't think that'd be very fair because again it regards expression of their own opinions. A staff team should let members speak their mind regarding certain issues. Of course if it gets out of hand then they definitely need to keep it calm and collected but never let anyone not say what they want.

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff?
Yes, I have. I've never been accused of abusing your powers, but I have been the victim of such, and currently still am but I will not go into detail about that.

[~Chantelle~]

When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum?
When the staff member tries to override the main admin and take control over the forum in an inappropriate manner. This could include, but is not limited to, banning members for no specific reason, making drastic changes to the forum without permission (ie. colour scheme, amount boards, etc.), asking members to provide personal information (ie. passwords), or imposing threats upon members/other staff.

Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning?
It really depends. Sometimes it's just a simple misunderstanding. I've been caught in this. I was a staff member on a forum and I thought a post was spam, so I locked it, but the main admin disagreed. We worked it out and I apologized to the member for confusion. On one of my own forums, I had a staff member who constantly took things I said the wrong way. She accused me of "embarrassing me in front of everyone". I sent her a private message clarifying what I meant when I said certain things and that I was in no way trying to be rude or belittle her. Eventually it got to the point where I couldn't work with her anymore; I was tired of trying to explain myself and eventually she got the other members convinced that I was the "bad guy" so I had no choice but to delete the forum. In the first case, all that needed to be done was a simple private message and it was never an issue again. The second case is more complicated and has more factors that I won't discuss, so it couldn't be resolved by PM so easily. Always give the benefit of the doubt first and politely explain to the staff member why you did not like what they did (unless what they did was really serious). The best way to prevent pushing of boundaries is to make boundaries very clear when you assign your staff members. Make a "contract" clearly specifying what they can and cannot do and what the punishments will be. If they think that's silly, then they shouldn't be a staff member.

What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs?
As I alluded to in the previous question, this goes beyond a simple misunderstanding that can be talked about over PM. In my opinion, this is a red flag that perhaps the staff member has ulterior motives of some kind. I doubt anyone with a genuine interest in helping out at a forum would want to blatantly treat the members with disrespect. I'd say maybe ban the staff for a while and have a word with them via email.

What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?
If someone did this, I would interpret that as them having a problem with the admin and not wishing to confront it. If the staff member has a problem with the admin and the way they run the forum, they can PM the admin politely with their constructive criticism/suggestions. They don't need to take it out on the forum. If a staff member really cannot set aside any personal issues/disagreements they have with the admin, then they really shouldn't be on the staff for that forum. It's human nature to disagree, but it's important that we handle disagreement in a constructive manner. The beauty of discussions on forums is seeing how many different opinions there are and why everyone believes what they believe.

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff?
I've had disagreements, but generally they got worked out. That second one in the earlier question that I mentioned did not turn out so great for me. What I would have done differently in the situation is being more clear about my expectations. It was my forum, I created it, and I shouldn't have let my mod walk all over me and letting her manipulate the members like that. I wanted it to be like a collaboration, more of a sense of "our forum" than "my forum". She wasn't clear on her powers and just started to add things on her own and take away things I added. I didn't mind at first, she was good at getting active members to come post. But that's where the power struggle came in, she recruited more members than I did, so she started to feel like it was her forum. It was then she started twisting words I said to make it sound like I was trying to be rude and disrespectful, when that was the last thing I wanted to convey! She said she deleted her posts after mine because when I replied it made it sound like I was trying to embarrass her. I tried so many times to give her the benefit of the doubt, constantly clarifying my intentions, but she didn't budge. One day, she came in and messed up the colours and sent me a PM that said "Oh oops, I was trying to change the colours up a bit and it didn't work out so well. I don't think we should really make forums together anymore, it just doesn't work out" or something along those lines and I noticed that she'd deleted her account shortly after it was sent. The other members were still on there, but they had been manipulated by her so there was no chance I was going to win them back, besides they were mostly her "friends" anyway. I cut my losses and deleted the forum. Lesson learned; collaboration forums do not work. One person is the main admin. It is their forum and their forum only. Any staff members are there solely to assist the admin in moderating the posts and in no way are they considered secondary owners. (you can see why I gave up on forums years ago)

[Former Member]

I would like to ask, say that a moderator has not logged in since mid-July. If I fire him coz he has not logged in or contubited to the forum in anyway since then, am I abusing my power?

[blc]

Jun 23, 2008 7:24:51 GMT -8 Enchant said:

Staff Abusing Powers, This seems to be a huge issue for many members.

There seems to be a continuous struggle regarding what the rights of a member are and the responsibilities of a staff member. When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum? Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning? What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs? What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff. Please keep in mind, that this isn't cyber bullying I am talking about, that is a whole different issue. This is about staff stepping over the line.

I also want to note, that while this does go on is some forums, it doesn't reflect all forums.

I don't allow all my staff to be able to lock, or delete threads.  I also rotate my mods monthly so that the mods can't lord it over the other members.

[Heathenpride]

Aug 20, 2013 21:30:15 GMT -8 pichu2pikachu2raichu said:

I would like to ask, say that a moderator has not logged in since mid-July. If I fire him coz he has not logged in or contubited to the forum in anyway since then, am I abusing my power?

Hi pichu2pikachu2raichu

If I were in your shoes I would get in touch with them and ask if everything is OK. They might have issues in RL or, and hopefully this is not the case, something drastic may have happened and they are not OK.

If you do not get a response then you would have reasonable grounds to assign the role to someone else IMO. You need a mod and the existing one is 'in absentia' so you have an immediate issue that needs correcting; that is the reason you replace them and no one could say that is being unfair.

I would then message them and explain what you have done and, according to the circumstances, they might be able to resume duties in the future if appropriate.

I have a very flexible attitude to my admins and staff, I deliberately have more than I really need so we can share the load and not get bogged down with duties, we would all rather be having fun.
That being said, though, I do only assign powers that are essential to each persons role and I expect a high standard of conduct (and boy, these guys are the best let me tell you) which includes letting me know if they may be absent for a while, if that happens the rest of us pitch in and cover duties. I had that very same thing happen last week, I got a PM from an admin saying he needed to take care of RL stuff. His duties will be taken on by me in this instance and when he returns all will be back to normal!

It works really well.

Hope it works out for you and I hope your mod is OK

HP

[Snakeair]

Aug 21, 2013 11:55:28 GMT -8 blc said:

Jun 23, 2008 7:24:51 GMT -8 Enchant said:

Staff Abusing Powers, This seems to be a huge issue for many members.

There seems to be a continuous struggle regarding what the rights of a member are and the responsibilities of a staff member. When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum? Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning? What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs? What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff. Please keep in mind, that this isn't cyber bullying I am talking about, that is a whole different issue. This is about staff stepping over the line.

I also want to note, that while this does go on is some forums, it doesn't reflect all forums.

I don't allow all my staff to be able to lock, or delete threads.  I also rotate my mods monthly so that the mods can't lord it over the other members.

Why do you rotate your moderators? This is not good because it's hard for loyal members to respect these moderators if they just temp's. You don't see large forums rotating moderators. The admin pick's the best people to do the moderating role and both the admin and moderator moderate the forum.

It's the main admins job to also monitor what his or her mods are doing and see if they actually doing any moderating or just moving, locking, abusing the power's. If you do not trust your moderators to do there duties then don't ever pick them as a moderator again.

Personally If I see moderators changing a lot in a short time span, I would not come back to the forum as I get the impression there are reason's why the moderators was changed so often. Mean's the admin can't find trustworthy people.  This just my opinion but I have been moderating on forums since 2001 on large forums which included Proboards.com at one point.

[blc]

Aug 22, 2013 6:46:14 GMT -8 Snakeair said:

Aug 21, 2013 11:55:28 GMT -8 blc said:

I don't allow all my staff to be able to lock, or delete threads.  I also rotate my mods monthly so that the mods can't lord it over the other members.

Why do you rotate your moderators? This is not good because it's hard for loyal members to respect these moderators if they just temp's. You don't see large forums rotating moderators. The admin pick's the best people to do the moderating role and both the admin and moderator moderate the forum.

It's the main admins job to also monitor what his or her mods are doing and see if they actually doing any moderating or just moving, locking, abusing the power's. If you do not trust your moderators to do there duties then don't ever pick them as a moderator again.

Personally If I see moderators changing a lot in a short time span, I would not come back to the forum as I get the impression there are reason's why the moderators was changed so often. Mean's the admin can't find trustworthy people.  This just my opinion but I have been moderating on forums since 2001 on large forums which included Proboards.com at one point.

I have a site that was very contentious for a while.  Lots of vulgarity and constant personal attacks.  I bought the site in May and am still looking to see who are better options.  But, having modded before and seen other mods delete things, I do not allow the mods that capability.  I've seen moderators that get bossy over time and I wanted the members to feel they were a part of the site.  One of the first mods I chose, would berate me in pm and chastise the members over the smallest things.  I thought i could trust him, but was proven otherwise, so I chose to ask for volunteers on a monthly basis.

I now have the site calmed down to the point that I may not need mods at all anymore.

Each forum and their members are different and they come with their own baggage.  A one size fits all doesn't always work.

[erosaf]

When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum?
When they automatically ban people without giving warnings, unless given express permission to do so.
Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning?
If the point of the disagreement carries on for months on end, yes. If its solved immediately, no.
What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs?
That is NOT acceptable at all.
What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?
Only if it is insulting to the entire site is this allowable.
Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff?
Yes. I am a staff member who bans those who prove themselves to be none other than forum trolls immediately. I let them sign up but as soon as they troll for me it is an instant ban for me. My staff agree too.

[Former Member]

    I am new to this thread.
    I am a forum member and owner. This helps me to view the other sides of the coin.

    
  

    

    
   
     
    
  
    
     
     
         

[The Hypocrisy of Truth]

When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum?

I think to a certain degree a lot of people have little quirks that they enjoy getting to have as perks of being a moderator. For example, I brought in a girl on my Forum that I had been friends with for a few months. She used to a be a global moderator on a site I played on for quite some time, and the admins there said that she had done splendidly, but she only left due to real life circumstances interfering with her activity and it was her own choice to quit. That really got my attention, because it proved that she could handle the responsibility of being a moderator, but back down if things got too heavy and she didn't trust herself to provide service up to par with what was expected. She accepted my offer for a global moderator position, but one of the first questions she asked was if she could fix the Karma on her profile to make it some crazy 1000+ number. I was a bit disappointed because I had already explaind to her that Karma points would also be used for rewards in competitions. Usually, I wouldn't care either way, but it wouldn't be fair for other members to have to earn their Karma level and for her to sit there with an insane amount of Karma just because she's a moderator.

She was a bit reluctant to understand and agree when I mentioned it to her again, but she hasn't been any trouble since that and I really enjoy having her there to help out. There are some people who enjoy being moderators to take care of members, a site, or just to help out a friend with a work load, but a lot of them also enjoy/want the perks that they perceive to come with that moderator position.

On the other hand, I made another good friend of mine a global moderator as well, and she has been nothing but perfect help. She's never asked about powers, what she can do or what she can't do, never asked to edit her own post count or Karma level. If I ask her to take on a job, it's done by the next day, and spectacularly. Half the time I wonder if she should be running the forum instead of me. I actually did offer her a position in Administration, but she denied due to time constraints. I had to leave for a week once, and I left the site in her care. When I came back, not only was everything still running smoothly but she had worked herself and the staff to make sure that progress was continually made, even in my absence.

My point being: There are some really crappy moderators out there who favor fellow staff and forget about members, or join/create cliques; there are some decent moderators who are really good at their job, trustworthy, but also expect perks that they shouldn't normally be allowed; then there are the few who become moderators and do a fantastic job and don't expect any perks or anything in return.

I don't think that there's a set time as to when a Moderator starts abusing their power, I think it has more to do with the person they are in general, and less to do with the temptations that could come with the position. It has less to do with signs that you should look out for, and more to do with people you should look out for.

Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning?

Absolutely not. A disagreement is nothing more than that; remember, disagreeing is not disobeying. Even when it comes to rules, if people have different opinions about what they should be than so be it. A warning doesn't need to happen for someone merely disagreeing, it comes into play when they act on those personal opinions in a way that negatively represents or affects the website or its members. Until then, there is no cause for a warning or banning, unless it gets to the points of harassment, abuse, or blatant, intentional disobedience.

What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs?

Again, unless what they are doing has some negative impact on the website or its members, why is there a need to threaten a warning or a ban? No member needs to be forced into submission, this is a free country. If they disobey the rules than they will either learn to obey them or be banned; if they really want to stay that bad they'll cooperate, not because they were forced to but because they chose to stay. That isn't the staff's doing, that's their own.

What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?

Once more, this is the same answer as the two prior questions. Disagreeing is not grounds for punishment; using those disagreements as a way to condone breaking site rules is. As long as the person continues following rules as expected, even if they disagree with them or anything else, there is no reason for disciplinary action.

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff?

I have had experience with this before; I was the victim of one of these situations on a site that I left. It was run by two admins who blatantly favored their staff over their members. Every staff member, and occasionally a regular member that the admins really liked, won all of the contests. No newbies won, no participants that usually kept to themselves outside of contests won, and it was all done privately so no one could prove it. One of the members actually called me a very foul, and sexually offensive, name openly in the C-Box. No one said anything to him because he was a staff member, so I spoke up in my own defense. When I did, almost immediately one of the administrators messaged me, asking how I could dare to start drama on her site and treat a member of her staff disrespectfully; further more, she went on to state that she reviewed the conversation in the chatbox and said something along the lines of, "I'm sure he was joking, and even if he wasn't I have no proof that you aren't a(n) [insert foul name here] anyway."

I think my jaw actually dropped in shock. The staff member in question was constantly vulgar, and quite blatantly sexist. Yet, no action was taken against him. Me, on the other hand? I got a warning and a scolding. Not only did I leave after that, but people who witnessed what happened left with me.

Words are a serious thing, and it isn't something people always understand. I see it a lot, people being offensive even when it's not meant because they don't understand the weight of what they're saying. "It's just a trend," "They know I'm not serious," "Oh, it's not that bad." It is. It doesn't matter if it's a trend, or you don't think it will hurt them, that doesn't mean it's okay to say or do. As someone who spends a lot of time counseling people, I've witnessed quite a bit of the darker side to some of the things that get said online, regardless of whether or not the intent was to harm them.

This is something staff should be especially careful of: Everything they say as a staff member is constantly monitored and witnessed by all present members at all times. One wrong word, one sentence taken a bit harder than intended, could not only end that person's respect for that staff member, and even the site as a whole, but we could lose one or more members because of it. Not only that, but if it really affects them that much, than that is bound to carry out into their personal lives and affect them there as well. There's a constant daisy chain of possibilities and outcomes from everything anyone could say at any given point in time.

Now, to be clear, that isn't to say that staff members should constantly be serious - in fact, I like it more when they're light hearted and do joke around - however, I do think that the staff should be more careful about wording things when it comes to reprimands. Keep it professional and impersonal. Even if you're in an argument and they're driving you crazy, do your best to be as kind as possible, in the end it'll paint you as the bigger person. Unfortunately, I've seen a lot of staff that either keep doing it or just don't care.

At the same time, people make mistakes - and have the right to make mistakes - so don't worry about it so much that you drive yourself nuts. It's just best, as a staff member, to make a conscious effort to put the members of the community first and think about how they could interpret what you are saying.

--------------------------

Well, that was a rant and a half, sorry about that. xD It's my inner mother hen/counselor talking. Okay, so there you go... Brownie points to anyone who actually read through all of that. I hope that wasn't too intense, I just have passions that need to be expressed. xD Okay, I'll stop talking now.