[Debate] Staff Abusing Powers

[markaew]

I just started a new forum because I was a victim of all the above as others had similar complaints. I spoke to the admin in private emails and he didn't seem to care. His forum is quite large and I assume he thought the majority was happy.

None the less, I started a similar forum.

[Dewers]

When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum?
To me, a staff pushes the boundaries of their power on a forum when they use their powers to gain an advantage or get something they want. I have worked on several sites from Moderator to NPC Overseer to Global Mod to Co-Admin. I was always put in charge of making sure that no staff member abused their powers. There was a case when I was a NPC Overseer (for those that aren't familiar with the term, I was the head of all NPC Moderators. I was the boss of everyone but the Global Mod and the Admins. My job was to train new staff, look out for potential staff, and make sure all staff are doing their jobs) and this staff member was handing out Pokemon he wanted to a member and saying to them in the post that he would give them Rare Candies if they caught it and gave it to his character. As the NPC Overseer, I created one rule for all staff which was approved by the Admin: members before yourself. That meant that member topics always came before your own topics. He always replied quickly to members, but never had time to get to his own thread, and never had time to reply to his own. Thus, he was using a member that was brand new to get what he wanted. I warned him that he would lose his position if he kept trying to gain thing without working for them. He shrugged my warnings off and kept doing what he was doing. I quickly removed him from power.

Another case was once on my site now. It had just opened and I was getting bogged down in so much work. We had a few new members and one of them offered to help me get in replies while I did all the updates I needed to do. I am very cautious with who becomes staff on my site. And I never give them any powers that can be used to harm members. No editing threads, no deleting threads, nothing. Being really busy with exams, I agreed, but I made it very clear that he was only there until life settled down, then he would go back to being a normal member. I left for three days and all the old members quit due to him being mean to them in the threads. He had tried to use his staff position to gain ends once again..

In short, a staff pushes past the boundaries of their powers to gain an end on the site. Staff should have an understanding that they are there to help the Admin and to make members happy. Not to gain an advantage.



Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning?
Only if it gets nasty. I have had two members fight on my forum before and I was told by the member that got offended to block the other one permanently. I never take advice from members on punishments, but the member blocked himself to avoid further arguments.

If it is a simple 'I disagree' and it stops there, then no. No warning or banning is required. However, if things get nasty or if a member refuses to obey the rules, then yes. A warning will be in place. If they continue and start getting smart over it? Banning them might be the best option as they are causing to much strife. However, I would never say jump with to banning anyone, staff, member or otherwise. Banning is, to me, a very harsh punishment that should only be given in extreme cases. In all my time of working on sites, even my own now, I have only had to block one person.


What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs?
If a staff tries to force a member into submission to believe what they do, then they don't deserve to be called staff. If a staff member really stoops as low as to warn or ban a member for disagreeing with them on, let's say, politics, then that staff member should be stripped of their power. It is not the staff member's job to do such a thing, in fact, no one should try to force another to believe in what they believe. To me, a staff member's main job is to make the member happy. If they start to abuse their powers or giving threats, then are they doing their job? No.

Now if a member disobeys the rules, I can understand threatening a warning, however, on my site I am the only one capable of giving warnings or exacting punishments. The reason? I don't want staff to abuse their powers. If a member refuses to obey the rules, then yes, a warning or a temporary ban is in order. But not if it is minor.


What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?
That is unacceptable. If the staff member that did that really is innocent of what the member accuses them of, then why erase the evidence? Modifying things in someone's post is a violation of their post. The staff member could edit in order to get the member in trouble or they can delete the post just because they didn't like the outcome of it. How fair is that? Not at all. Again, that staff member shouldn't be staff if they do such a thing.


Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff?
Yes, yes, and yes.

I experienced this on a site I was on for about a month. I joined to help me learn how to write better and become a better role player. All of the staff members were so kind and nice. Yet I noticed something off, the admin usually never logged on and when they did, they talked so rudely to those staff members and the members. I was a little concerned since everyone seemed fine with it. I decided to stay out of the chat box for my own good. A new member joined and I finally decided to talk int he chat box to welcome them and help them with what I knew, no other staff members were online but the admin. That admin was getting very rude to me for helping the member and saying 'I had no right to tell a new member how to post on the forum since I wasn't a staff' and that I just needed to shut up. It wasn't that kind, but I quickly grew sick of it and left. I came back about a week later only to find the whole site going against the admin.

I have been accused of abusing my powers before. I have been told that I was 'supporting bad behavior' on one of the members. However, when a member got upset about something someone said, they brought it to me in PM's, which I was very grateful for. However, they over reacted and the other member said nothing to them like they were claiming. I reviewed the discussion over and over again in the shout box yet saw nothing. I was told that I had to ban the member for being rude and that I needed to punish everyone else for supporting the bad behavior. My response was simply 'you overreacted a bit, but I will have a talk with him about what he said and make him apologize'. The member that got upset was going to quit, yet he didn't after thinking it over. Another time I was accused of using my position on my site to 'ignore members'. In the shout box, some member began to call me lazy and said I was using my Admin title to ignore members and to not get to any replies. That member had a reply waiting from me for well over a month. I brushed it off and let him quit. I said I couldn't please everyone and that I was sorry he felt that way.

In the end, everyone is going to experience something like this, but how and to what degree is always different.

--

That seems more like a rant now that I think about it o3o'' oops? :'D Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter. All I can suggest to those wanting to start a forum or wanting to hire staff is: be sure that you don't abuse your powers and always try to be fair. But you can't make everyone happy. Just try your best! You can do it!

[rose85]

I like to share story, a real life story that really happen in a forum, it create many concern and pain alike of authority abuse. At first it's supposed to be a fun forum of role-play, with deletion button added as widget every one is in great dismay of trying understand how forum governed by new admin. One of staff member misused button and spread discow of siding people to leave more than stay, admin did step in diffuse situation and calm community members down, it did not stop there, our next admin in charge raise lot of question and few of them find a topic what all members think it just a fuss shouldn't be kicked. It stated that in the rule no one should talk about nudity or any graphic, as forum made to be family friendly not as young adult forum, with this rule bend everything turn uneasy as rules are disregard and what's irony is admin who create forum turn blind eye to it she's the one who write the rules and partner she ask for is basically a troublemaker who has records with me as senior staff member of a forum.
It then end up second admin in charge, bending rules again, more than one lost count as it affect many to delete account of terrible management, what's more is every members had marked that admin is trying over the top she is the best than others, unconsciously driven RP Cho Chang away for remarks of her racist comment, verbally, emotionally, let RP Cho feel every heat of it as who is more hypocrite is that admin, she's the one who officially to have rules bend and scolding for no apparent reason just sake of abuse and misuse. Afterwards, our staff RP Cho was left and never heard from that day onwards.
A lot of fights continuing pile up. Lot of member sign up to be more Slytherin than rest, the quota is shockingly bad which is enough to close down forum. Fights keep on coming until one day I had to rest after having minor heart attack, I did not return but rest.
After this episodes, members stop coming to forum. When there is voting member chose seventh year of dark days to roleplay Death Eaters, and forum becoming more adult mainstream than targeting family than it used to be under former admin's reign, forum is second site with that RP admin. Violence is more emphasis in chosen year, and forum leading to mature theme and no one step up to had it reform back. What's more, when admin is modded, even they are having fun and taking it easy, admin did demote staff for being realistic more than her.
When the forum evolve more, I did not stay long and there is more nothing I can say, that I myself felt hopeless can't change history if go there, I might end up hurt myself along the way. Why I say all this, because I'm not happy that kind of RP admin can get away anything as being a boss. No one bother stand up to her and every one who left is likely slightly mad or turn unhappy because it's poor management of what RP admin did and successfully letting forum to die.
No one had go around recuit who can be next RP staff member to teach subject and leaving to rot as no one willing to help with reason RP admin give serious atttitude how bad person she can be.
My world, of my favorite site forum had crash down, I know it's RP they turning it into, I find it's hard disbelieving RP site had led to disappointing ending as I felt instant heartbreak missing old forum. It's one of untold story about serious misuse and abuse, it's real scenario, now forum is still maintaining and RP admin turn out to be a lonely gal. How she able to escape and not to have forum marked suspension is beyond me. Forum just got away as it break many rules one read and agree in past as past log is no longer existed. So friends, if you saw this situation or scenario don't doubt forum won't fall it has to be brought up to support forum if forum you see broke too much rules for RP admins themselves don't know what is definition of rules for sake violence which gone through more than one month. This is untold story, I want every one to know this, urge friends be vigilant what will they see risk upon joining forum of rules disregard.

[Callista Moonfire]

When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum?
- I believe that a staff member has pushed the boundaries whenever they no longer consult with the other staff members or admin about something they want to do. Especially if it is involving banning members/changing the boards/editing the forum itself (the layouts/coding/etc.) Because as a staff member I would never think to alter an admins forum without their permission to do so, nor creating some huge plot without at least talking it over with the other staff members to get their opinions or at the very least, let them know what's going on. As for banning members, I allowed staff to ban people within reason, but there was an area in the staff chat for them to post who they banned and give a reason so no one could argue about it later on.

Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning?
- Of course not, I've had disagreements with staff members over an issue or something they wanted to do. We either made a thread where we could all voice our opinions or created a chat outside of the forum to discuss the disagreement and find some type of compromise.

What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs?
- This is something tat should never ever be done. Everyone is entitled to have their own beliefs and it would be unfair for a staff member to try and push that onto a member. And I would always encourage a member to write down or copy everything that was said to them to have proof and if they brought it to my attention that a staff member was doing that then the staff member would be getting demoted or possibly banned for that type of behavior.

What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?
- Well I would hope that a staff member wouldn't delete my post or threads, if they did then they had better have a very good reason for why they would do such a thing and I don't really believe that disagreeing with something is good enough for that. Admins create their forums, staff work there, it would be just like in a work place, you can voice your ideas and opinions, but in the end it's up to the admin to make the final call or decision so if you have 2 staff members having a problem then it would be best to see the admin about it. Ultimately, this is a matter that should always be discussed before simply deleting something.

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff?
- I have not been a member anywhere with power mad staff, nor have I been accused of it, because I like to think that I set up a fair system where my members or staff can talk to me about any issues they have and I will be fair with them because I might have something I want to discuss with them sometime that they might not like and I would hope that they would listen to my opinions.
-However I have had the issue where a staff member under me got power-mad and they began abusing members and going against my opinions behind my back or outright making a spectacle of themselves on the forum itself. I had no choice but to eventually ban them for their behavior after they had been warned many many times about taking their power too far.

[cvvcdad]

Nov 2, 2012 5:35:16 GMT -8 cvvcdad said:

Nov 2, 2012 2:55:37 GMT -8 🎶Sossity🎶 said:

Hi

please keep the discussion Proboards forum related and without mentioning the name of mods and other staff.

If you have a grievance with a forum hosted elsewhere, please take it up with that host.

Please keep to this board's posting criteria.

Thanks.

not trying to be difficult, but i don't see where my post violated any of the criteria from the link you provided:

Important Rules:




You may not post your board URL in any threads. Period!

All discussions must remain 100% on topic. If you go off topic, you will receive a warning. Any other discussion belongs in PMs!

This board should be used for intelligent discussion of the topic presented. If you don't have something valuable to add to the topic, don't post. There is no need to post anything like "Thanks for the ideas" as it does not add to the discussion.

Your posts should be at least 4 sentences long. Anything less shows that not enough thought was taken in the post, and is most likely not productive towards the conversation.

Don't ask support related questions here. If you have a problem with your forum, please go to the support board.

The bump rules are more lenient in this board because of the amount of topics and their nature. However, if bumping an older topic, please keep your post relevant.

1) i didn't post the url.

2) i believe my post is spot on regarding "Staff Abusing Powers".

3) i suppose you might consider my post not to be "intelligent", but that's a rather subjective standard. i do honestly believe, however, that it added some value to this discussion. warnings to the internet community are typically considered to be of some value.

4) plenty of sentences.

5) n/a -- not a support-related post.

6) n/a -- not a bump.

i actually did read the rules, sossity, before i posted, because i wanted to make sure the specificity was allowed. i don't see anything anywhere that says one cannot name the board or the mods in question. so i'd really appreciate it if you'd unedit my post.

lastly -- i am utterly unable to "take it up with" volley talk. that's the whole point of my post: staff abusing powers by summarily banning a poster for no reason and with no explanation. how can i take this up with the mod who has cut off my access? can't send him a pm now. and i did send an email to volley talk's general email address. guess what? no response. posting here was my last resort. i'm hoping perhaps the "mod in question" stops by here every now and then, because it's the only way i now have to make my case. perhaps if proboards modifies its code to allow banned posters to pm mods...? at least that would have done away with the need to post here.

now do you understand?

and...now i've been banned.

you be the judge.  my original post was in the "off the net" forum, as it is non-political in nature.  among other things done by the mod, he decided a post on faith and science belonged on the politics forum.  this gives you some needed context.

so here is the in-thread discussion i had with a particular poster on the politics forum who also happens to be a mod (a mod with whom i have had problems in the past) -- his posts are in red:

God -- or quantum fluctuation?
 [http://creation.com/god-created-not-quantum-fluctuation]


"...Einstein’s general relativity, which has much experimental support, shows that time is linked to matter and space. So time itself would have begun along with matter and space, an insight first pointed out by Augustine in the fourth century. Since God, by definition, is the Creator of the whole universe, he is the Creator of time. Therefore, He is not limited by the time dimension He created, so has no beginning in time...



...the favourite philosopher of modern atheists, the Scotsman David Hume (1711–1776)...taught that one might conceive of something coming into being without a cause.



However, British analytic philosopher (and conservative Roman Catholic) G.E.M. (Elizabeth) Anscombe (1919–2001) argued cogently that no one really conceives of any such thing. To paraphrase one of her points, suppose that a banana suddenly appeared on your plate. You would not think, “Hume was right after all—this banana really did come into being without a cause.” No, you would think, “How did that banana get there?” and look for the likely cause. Maybe there was a hole in the ceiling above it, or in the plate below it. If that were ruled out, then maybe you were temporarily unaware of your surroundings, and in that time, someone placed the banana there without your noticing. Failing that, maybe a magician’s trick, or even a miracle, was the cause. Regardless, even an unknown cause would be more likely than no cause...



So even though Hume claimed that one could easily conceive of something coming into being without a cause, in reality, he likely never really conceived any such thing. Indeed, it seems impossible to conceive. Hume himself, in more lucid moments, even admitted as much:



'But allow me to tell you that I never asserted so absurd a Proposition as that anything might arise without a cause: I only maintain’d, that our Certainty of the Falsehood of that Proposition proceeded neither from Intuition nor Demonstration; but from another Source.'



...a number of atheists have claimed that the universe really came from ‘nothing’...



...physicist and atheistic propagandist Lawrence Krauss (1954– ) has promoted this notion, and even wrote a book, A Universe from Nothing, which had a glowing afterword by prominent atheist Richard Dawkins. However, Luke Barnes, a non-creationist astrophysicist who is a Postdoctoral Researcher at the Sydney Institute for Astronomy, University of Sydney, Australia, is scathing about Krauss and those who argue like him:



'First and foremost, I’m getting really rather sick of cosmologists talking about universes being created out of nothing. Krauss repeatedly talked about universes coming out of nothing, particles coming out of nothing, different types of nothing, nothing being unstable. This is nonsense. The word nothing is often used loosely—I have nothing in my hand, there’s nothing in the fridge etc. But the proper definition of nothing is “not anything”. Nothing is not a type of something, not a kind of thing. It is the absence of anything.'



...Some physicists assert that quantum mechanics violates this cause/effect principle and can produce something from nothing. For instance, Paul Davies writes:



'… spacetime could appear out of nothingness as a result of a quantum transition. … Particles can appear out of nowhere without specific causation … the world of quantum mechanics routinely produces something out of nothing.'



But this is a gross misapplication of quantum mechanics. Quantum mechanics never produces something out of nothing. Davies himself admitted on the previous page that his scenario ‘should not be taken too seriously.’ Also, theories that the universe is a quantum fluctuation must presuppose that there was something to fluctuate—their ‘quantum vacuum’ is a lot of matter-antimatter potential—not ‘nothing’. So this is another equivocation.



However, Krauss is still resorting to these fallacies, as Luke Barnes points out, explaining in more detail how the term ‘nothing’ is misused:



'Now let’s look at Krauss’ claims again. Does it make sense to say that there are different types of not anything? That not anything is not stable? This is nonsense. What Krauss is really talking about is the quantum vacuum. The quantum vacuum is a type of something. It has properties. It has energy, it fluctuates, it can cause the expansion of the universe to accelerate, it obeys the (highly non-trivial) equations of quantum field theory. We can describe it. We can calculate, predict and falsify its properties. The quantum vacuum is not nothing.



This suggests a very simple test for those who wish to talk about nothing: if what you are talking about has properties, then it is not nothing. It is pure equivocation to refer to the quantum vacuum as nothing when a philosopher starts asking the question “why is there something rather than nothing?”. She is not asking “why are there particles rather than just a quantum vacuum?”. She is asking “why does anything exist at all?”. As Stephen Hawking once asked, why does the universe go to all the bother of existing?'



...Barnes’ objections to Krauss’s equivocations are shared by philosopher David Albert, professor of philosophy at Columbia University, NY, who also has a doctorate in theoretical physics...



'Where, for starters, are the laws of quantum mechanics themselves supposed to have come from? Krauss is more or less upfront, as it turns out, about not having a clue about that. He acknowledges (albeit in a parenthesis, and just a few pages before the end of the book) that every¬thing he has been talking about simply takes the basic principles of quantum mechanics for granted. …



Krauss seems to be thinking that these vacuum states amount to the relativistic-¬quantum-field-theoretical version of there not being any physical stuff at all. And he has an argument—or thinks he does—that the laws of relativistic quantum field theories entail that vacuum states are unstable. And that, in a nutshell, is the account he proposes of why there should be something rather than nothing.



But that’s just not right. Relativistic-quantum-field-theoretical vacuum states—no less than giraffes or refrigerators or solar systems—are particular arrangements of elementary physical stuff. The true relativistic-quantum-field-¬theoretical equivalent to there not being any physical stuff at all isn’t this or that particular arrangement of the fields—what it is (obviously, and ineluctably, and on the contrary) is the simple absence of the fields! The fact that some arrangements of fields happen to correspond to the existence of particles and some don’t is not a whit more mysterious than the fact that some of the possible arrangements of my fingers happen to correspond to the existence of a fist and some don’t. And the fact that particles can pop in and out of existence, over time, as those fields rearrange themselves, is not a whit more mysterious than the fact that fists can pop in and out of existence, over time, as my fingers rearrange themselves. And none of these poppings—if you look at them aright—amount to anything even remotely in the neighborhood of a creation from nothing.'



Krauss’s is just the latest in a series of philosophically inept books by the soi-disant ‘new atheists’. It’s hard to disagree with the Thomist19 philosopher Edward Feser, Associate Professor of Philosophy at Pasadena City College:



'The spate of bad books on philosophy and religion by prominent scientists—Dawkins’ The God Delusion, Hawking and Mlodinow’s The Grand Design, and Atkins’ On Being, among others—is notable not only for the sophomoric philosophical and theological errors they contain but also for their sheer repetitiveness. Krauss’ fallacious account of how something can come from nothing, though presented as a great breakthrough, and praised as such by Dawkins in his afterword, is largely a rehash of ideas already put forward by Hawking, Mlodinow, and some less eminent physics popularizers. Dawkins has been peddling the “Who created the creator?” meme since the eighties.

Critics have exposed their errors and fallacies again and again. Yet these writers keep repeating them anyway...'



The Bible presupposes that God began the universe. The fact of the universe’s beginning points strongly to a Creator consistent with the biblical God. Some atheists, following Hume, have asserted that something can begin without a cause, but this is not only unreasonable, it is arguably inconceivable. The ‘New Atheists’ have resorted to quantum bluffing to claim that something really can come from nothing. But they must equivocate about the word ‘nothing’. This really should mean nothing—no properties. However, their proposed quantum vacuum is not nothing; it must be something, with properties—e.g. the quantum vacuum, which is being bound by the laws of quantum physics, so that it can ‘fluctuate’.



'In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.' It stands to reason."



now that's a good read!



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxMdlz4r



This topic is best kept on the Political Ramblings board, which, by default, now includes discussions involving religion.



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxMlhKiw



i must disagree with this decision on principle.



if this stands however -- will you also be changing the name of this board, and also the descriptions for this and the off the net board, to make it clear to everyone where they need to go in order to post &/or read posts on faith, religion, and saving faith?



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxMqoMAa



and...what about threads regarding science in off the net, when the issue of science/faith eventually arises? will they stay, or will they go?



my unsolicited advice would be to keep the politics board politics-only, because faith is an integral part of the worldview of believers, just as unbelief is an integral part of the worldview of non-believers. it will pop up in discussions on various topics as a matter of course.



politics, however, seems to be its own animal.



this would seem to be a can of worms you are opening here.



also -- continuing to think out loud -- if this decision stands, i would think it will preclude any possibility of shutting down the politics board, which is proposed from time to time.



i'm sure vt would not want to be seen as a place where people are not allowed to discuss their faith (in whatever they have placed their faith).



right...?



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxMvdmWA



Well, that might be possible if people weren't posting deliberately confrontational items on religion. I hear you, but I disagree.



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxN0KXNP



are you saying that the original post in this thread is "deliberately confrontational"?



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxN9JrZb



I am. Just as your comment in the twin babies was deliberately confrontational.



You are not fooling anyone. You are free to do what you are doing, but don't pretend you aren't doing it. It's insulting.



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxNDYYm8



you could not be more wrong. you are terrible at trying to read my mind. my comment in the twin babies thread was a scientific fact, and nothing more. your censoring of it was a mistake and you know it -- a mistake atoned for once you came to your senses and allowed my second post to stand -- the one with a link that further documented the simple scientific fact from the first, censored, post.



i have news for you: that feeling of being insulted is not really that at all. it is actually guilt.



as for "knowing" my "deliberate" intent?



your clairvoyance seems extremely familiar. and, as always, off the mark. you reveal more and more about yourself when you post things like this.



and as for this thread's op -- i challenge you to quote anything in it that is the least bit "confrontational".



you might want to look that word up in your dictionary scripture before you take up that challenge...



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxNIP500



(to elevationvb)…everyone on this board knows that the article -- containing insults to Atheists galore -- was meant to provoke.



Case closed.



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation#ixzz2lxNTkqEK



so, judge and jury, are we?



the only confrontational and insulting posts in this thread are yours, ganger.



and everyone here -- except for you & your cabal -- know that.



it's a real shame that you find scientific facts and philosophical musings with which you disagree to be, by definition, confrontational and insulting.



but thanks for coming out from behind the curtain and showing your true colors.



it's been both interesting and informative...



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation?page=2#ixzz2lxNepYkg



I prefer not to do this publicly, but if cvvcdad continues to post here, I will respond.



"i found the fact that "nothing", to the something-from-nothing believers, cannnot actually be nothing but in fact must be something, fascinating. because of this, those who have put their faith in s-f-n are rather boxed in.
"




The above post disproves everything you have said. If someone started a thread in Off-the-Net with scientific proof of some of the errors in the Bible's genesis story, that thread would be moved, HAS been moved.



That is the equivalent of what you have done.



I am taking no stance on this issue. I am simply moving a post which cannot be responded to without offending some people on this board (as you have offended some people with the original post) from Off-the-Net to Political Ramblings -- where all similar threads reside.



Drop it now. Continue to insult the board moderation and there will be consequences.



Read more: volleytalk.proboards.com/thread/51900/beginning-god-quantum-fluctuation?page=2#ixzz2lxNklcj4



unbelievable.



you "prefer not to do this publicly"?



don't kid yourself.



"disproves everything [i've] said"?



laughable.



"errors in ...Genesis"?



there are no errors in Genesis.



and with this statement, we know exactly where you're coming from.



when you said that some here are "insulted" by this thread, you meant yourself, didn't you?



does anyone else find it interesting that only 1 other poster has used the word "insult" when describing their reaction to my posts on Christ?



you are "taking no stance" on this issue?



then how do you explain your pm to me?



lastly -- "insult the board moderation"?



you may have taken offense to the content of my op, ganger. that's fine. but i have in no way "[insulted] the board moderation", only a moderator/poster. there is a huge difference, or at least there should be. i disagreed with your choice of forum, and i raised a legit concern about the effect a possible shutting down of the political forum -- something that has been suggested a number of times -- would have on expression of faith here. that's all. by no means did i insult board moderation.



it is extremely apparent that it is faith -- actually, it is Christ -- which offends you. fine. He tells us that this will happen.



you need to separate your poster persona from your mod persona, because i have in no way disparaged the way you or any other mod does that job...


so...do staff abuse power on that board?

[Beyonder]

if i am ok to say i am not like that i never ever abused my powers on any of my websites but i have seen other staff do and i derank them because it makes people wanna leave a site i for 1 am against that! if you guys see a mod or admin do this report them

[cvvcdad]

and...now the mod just flat-out lies.

posted today, 12/18/13, 0:14:09 EST:

Two things:



1) cvvcdad was not banned...

i was, in fact, banned immediately after the exchange i posted above on 11/28/2013.  i remain banned from the forum -- not warned, banned.  i access it via proxy -- in read-only mode, of course.

this conduct is unconscionable, and this mod gets away with it regularly.  so it's time to name names:

"Doppelganger".

if you post on volleytalk, be aware of the "moderation" you are dealing with.  he/she has no tolerance for Christ, and yet has a major, and demonstrable, God complex.  ironic, that.  he/she flaunts his/her "authority".

Doppelganger is exhibit a for staff abusing powers.

Doppelganger is a liar.

Doppelganger is a bully -- and the worst kind, the kind that smacks you down for their own pleasure, and then lies about it.

Doppelganger is everything a mod should not be.

so please -- if you go to volleytalk, do not tread carefully so as not to incur Doppelganger's wrath.  instead, expose him/her for what he/she is.  it is the only way to silence a bully like Doppelganger...

[Former Member]

I was sure I had already replied to this thread but I guess it has been a while anyway so maybe a new answer! Please forgive me if I have already replied here.

---

        1. When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum?

When they start pushing people around and listening to only one side of the story and not the other. When they start enforcing rules too much. When they start making their friends admins over people who have been loyal to the site for a long time and start being unfair to eachother.

        2. Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning?

Warning: Warnings should be given carefully, if the admin disagrees with the member's opinion - that member shouldn't warn them unless the person has really breeched some rules. Or insults the admin/staff/members

Banning: No, unless the disagreement has gone on for too long and the perpetrator refuses to stop. However if the disagreement is between you (the admin) and a member the Admin has to stop and think before they ban. Are they doing it for the good of the site or for the good of themselves?.

        3. What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs?

Wrong

        4. What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?

Bad! very bad!

        5. Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff.

Yes, I have had experience with this - on some sites - not naming them.

Yes, I have been accused of abusing my powers and I was forgiven and allowed back on that site after a lengthy ban. Yes I learned from this experience. I admit I was simply getting too big for my boots there and stressed out.

Yes, I was a victim of abusive staff.

Back when I was a rookie RPer - and a new proboards user. I was also a RPer on an invision.free site (That site has since been taken down). At the time I was also admin on my own Proboards site - also one of the members on that site was also one of the admins of my site. (This is important later).

It's an interesting story...

I was a fan of a TV show and wanted to join an RP site, so I took my own O.C and joined an invision.free site that had been advertised on a proboards site.

When I applied the first thing that happened was the admin contacted me and said my character couldn't be the brother of his Canon (even though I had asked and was told yes) - But I accepted anyway and changed it to just a really really good friend.

Things settled and I soon became fast friends with this Admin and his Co-Admin...

Then a new member joined and the Admin started talking with her a lot ... and I started getting pushed around a lot - treated badly by BOTH Co-Admin and Admin AND Member... They'd make up lies just to wind me up and then hassle me for something I didn't do. (I won't go into the details of it all - that is a different story).

It was just a messy complicated thing but I didn't have the courage back then....I just took it.

One day a Co-Admin on my site came to me asking permission to do a certain thread on my site and I denied it due to it being against rules.

Later that day I get a IM from the Admin of the invision.free berating me for telling HIS ADMIN what to do and that I was banned from HIS site and told never to interfere again...

I approached my admin and asked her what it was he was on about, it turned out that she had done the idea on HIS site too and told HIM that I had declined her idea. She simply hadn't told him that it was on MY site that I had declined the idea.

She approached him and explained it, he let me back onto his site but never apologised.

Later a whole bucket of stuff happened which I won't go into but the bullying went on for some time til I left - since then I have tried to ensure there is no bullying on the sites I am on.

[Nefa]

Jun 23, 2008 7:24:51 GMT -8 Enchant said:

Staff Abusing Powers, This seems to be a huge issue for many members.

There seems to be a continuous struggle regarding what the rights of a member are and the responsibilities of a staff member. When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum? Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning? What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs? What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff. Please keep in mind, that this isn't cyber bullying I am talking about, that is a whole different issue. This is about staff stepping over the line.

I also want to note, that while this does go on is some forums, it doesn't reflect all forums.

Well, I have definitely been on forums where staff have abused their powers, mostly by cyberbullying and generally being unfriendly. This might not technically be considered an abuse of power, but in my opinion it definitely is. A good forum makes the members feel welcomed and included, and I spent years trying to feel that way before realizing the forums I was using were trash.
I am protective over my forums and do consider them my forums. I do not like them sharing them with other staff members. That's why I write out very specific guides on how the forum is to be run and am very picky about choosing staff members. I guess I'm a bit of a control freak, but this way, there is very little chance of staff members acting inconsistently with each other.
Staff members are role models of the forum. If they break a rule, especially if they act rude or immature towards another member, they should be removed as a staff member. No question about it. I hate demoting people as much as the next person, but it has to be done. A robotic approach is best when it comes to choosing staff members. A good staff is professional and not afraid to warn anyone, be it a friend, staff member, or a mortal enemy. Not that warnings are good, but they are necessary to keep everyone in line.
With matters like religion and other sensitive topics, you need to be more careful, but public disrespect from a staff member is the last thing I want to see happening.
Threats to warn or ban are not good, and should be avoided. Threatening to ban someone because they don't agree with you is outrageous and is an obvious sign of an immature and unworthy staff member. Warn/ban threats are acceptable if a member has already been warned/banned repeatedly and is on his or her last chance (e.g., "If you continue to flame then I will ban you.").
I dislike deleting threads in general and avoid doing it when possible. Even threads that contain swears and explicit content are moved to a staff-only board in case they are needed for future reference. Deleting a thread because the OP does not agree with you is out of the question.
Disrespect is the worst thing that you can have on a forum. Forcing someone to agree with you in order to stay on the forum is terrible. It is understandable if you run a forum centered around one belief, and someone registered just to yell at you and make fun of that belief--but that's just trolling, and breaks a lot more rules than just disagreeing with a staff member.

[Himms]

Jan 11, 2014 18:27:34 GMT -8 Nefa said:

Jun 23, 2008 7:24:51 GMT -8 Enchant said:

Staff Abusing Powers, This seems to be a huge issue for many members.

There seems to be a continuous struggle regarding what the rights of a member are and the responsibilities of a staff member. When do you think a staff member has pushed the boundaries of power on a forum? Is a disagreement grounds for a warning or banning? What about idle threats to warn or ban a member in order to forced them into submission with their own beliefs? What about deletion of your post and threads because they disagreed with what was posted?

Have you had experience with this? Were you ever accused of abusing your powers or a member who was a victim of an abusive staff. Please keep in mind, that this isn't cyber bullying I am talking about, that is a whole different issue. This is about staff stepping over the line.

I also want to note, that while this does go on is some forums, it doesn't reflect all forums.

Well, I have definitely been on forums where staff have abused their powers, mostly by cyberbullying and generally being unfriendly. This might not technically be considered an abuse of power, but in my opinion it definitely is. A good forum makes the members feel welcomed and included, and I spent years trying to feel that way before realizing the forums I was using were trash.
I am protective over my forums and do consider them my forums. I do not like them sharing them with other staff members. That's why I write out very specific guides on how the forum is to be run and am very picky about choosing staff members. I guess I'm a bit of a control freak, but this way, there is very little chance of staff members acting inconsistently with each other.
Staff members are role models of the forum. If they break a rule, especially if they act rude or immature towards another member, they should be removed as a staff member. No question about it. I hate demoting people as much as the next person, but it has to be done. A robotic approach is best when it comes to choosing staff members. A good staff is professional and not afraid to warn anyone, be it a friend, staff member, or a mortal enemy. Not that warnings are good, but they are necessary to keep everyone in line.
With matters like religion and other sensitive topics, you need to be more careful, but public disrespect from a staff member is the last thing I want to see happening.
Threats to warn or ban are not good, and should be avoided. Threatening to ban someone because they don't agree with you is outrageous and is an obvious sign of an immature and unworthy staff member. Warn/ban threats are acceptable if a member has already been warned/banned repeatedly and is on his or her last chance (e.g., "If you continue to flame then I will ban you.").
I dislike deleting threads in general and avoid doing it when possible. Even threads that contain swears and explicit content are moved to a staff-only board in case they are needed for future reference. Deleting a thread because the OP does not agree with you is out of the question.
Disrespect is the worst thing that you can have on a forum. Forcing someone to agree with you in order to stay on the forum is terrible. It is understandable if you run a forum centered around one belief, and someone registered just to yell at you and make fun of that belief--but that's just trolling, and breaks a lot more rules than just disagreeing with a staff member.

Not a bad idea..I might consider a guide. While it might be a pain to get one out.....it will be worth the hassle.

And if they are being immature/rude with the staff....namely Admins...then what?

[cvvcdad]

and the lies continue.

there seems to be a few vt posters convinced that i have re-appeared under another username.  while i continue to monitor the board, i have zero interest in wading back into that cesspool.

however, the mod doppelganger continues to lie:

It is not against forum rules to have multiple accounts. It is against forum rules to create multiple accounts for the sole purpose of supporting opinions stated by the separate accounts.



That said, cvvcdad was banned for continuing to argue about a decision Board moderation had made. When he created two more accounts to argue about it, a suspension turned into a banning.



His new account can remain, but he is still on probation.


1) i absolutely was not banned for the reason doppelganger gives above.  that is called "cya".  the record speaks for itself.  another lie.

2) i did not create 2 more accounts "to argue about it".  another lie.

3) i was never suspended -- again, the record speaks for itself.  i was immediately banned rather than "suspended", and i have given proof of that.  another lie.

4) i have no new account.  another lie.

5) i am not on probation.  i am banned.  another lie.

no one on vt really knows what doppelganger has done.  that's why i'm posting here, in the hope that someone from vt will see it and know exactly who and what doppelganger is.

[h4ckforh4ck]

I have to agree that a forum i got banned form for no reason.When i joined back the croupt Moderator Ban me for no reason.It was the admin who step in unbanned me and Banned the Moderator.

[Pebbles]

not on a proboards forum nor my own right now
but in the past on another kpop forum
god, don't get me started
that staff team was corrupt and fkd up
and people did indeed abuse their powers there

if i see that happen i instantly quit a forum, cannot stand anything like that