Finding Admins/Mods

[HARP]

I was looking through the Discussions again and found my answer support.proboards.com/thread/309716
Other tips will still be appreciated on this question though.

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Hello. I looked around these sections for some time. I gotta say the Promoting Your Forum Discussions are a very good read. However, as helpful as those topis were, they did not seem to answer one of my main questions.

How do you go about finding Admin and Mods and other staff to help you run and build your forum?

Right now I am the only Admin since I just recently started this project a few days ago. However, I know I am going to need help on areas that I am weak. Plus more minds are way better then one.

I have witnessed Admins abusing their power, and poor organization and communication among staff. I recently had to leave a project because one of the other Admins started was acting like his opinion was the only one that mattered.

So my questions are:
Where should one go to find Admins and Mods?
What should be in the application if there is one?
What are some key red flags to look out for?

I am thinking of having everyone whose app looks good start in a trail period to see how the preform and act.
In the app I have thought up currently I have some hypothetical questions based on incidences I have personally witnesses red flags show up in.

I am not completely sure how to go about this recruitment process.

Tips and advice will be greatly appreciated!
Thank you for your time.

[Kami]

Ooh nice topic :D

Where should one go to find Admins and Mods?

Honestly, my personal preference is to hire from within, so to speak. Unlike a "real world" job, you can't run background checks or contact past employers to make sure the person you hire is trustworthy, so I feel that admin and mod positions should go to members who have proven themselves the model member: friendly, helpful & knowledgeable about the forum's rules & procedures, and active. I don't advise hiring strangers in any capacity, unless you take the time to cultivate a relationship with them BEFORE ever indicating you're interested in asking them to staff (so that they don't put on a front). In my time here on ProBoards Support, a vast majority of "hacked" forums are a result of the admin trusting a stranger with administrative powers, which that stranger then abuses by deleting content/members, banning people, destroying themes and custom pages, or all of the above.

It might be more difficult, however, if you're an inexperienced forum owner who needs help with coding / design / setup, since you might look for people to assist. But that's what Support is here for: the PB admins & volunteer helpers here are more than willing to help you with your forum without requiring you to promote them to staff.

What should be in the application if there is one?

If you choose to go this route, I would treat it similar to a real world application:
- name/alias
- other names/aliases they've gone by
- amount of experience
- linked references to other forums
- contact info from other forum owners they've worked with (this could simply be a link to a forum where you can leave a guest message)

What are some key red flags to look out for?

The biggest red flag I'd think of is if they're more interested in the position than the forum itself. Are they eager to participate in generating forum content? Or are they more interested in their staff title and telling people what to do? Do they have any experience with the forum genre? For example, if you're making an RP forum, have the ever RP'd before? Do they plan on RPing? If the answer to both of these is no, I'd not be interested in having them as a staff member. You want staff members who are invested in your forum beyond the staff position, otherwise, there no guarantee they'll stay or care about its success.

Some other things I'd look out for / have fired people off my staff for:

- not consulting other staff members before making a decision (eg: an ex-mod of mine created a forum-wide poll asking who peoples' favourite staff member was -- this is not something we care about, because it puts members on the spot)

- how willing they are to bend the rules for their friends (eg: a different ex-mod knew that their friend, who had been banned after going through our entire warning system over the course of the year, had returned under a different name / IP address. obviously this wasn't allowed, and once it was discovered they were demoted)

- whether or not (if they are already a regular member) they've been in trouble with you before for breaking the rules or other poor behaviour. now, it's obviously not always an indication of how good a staff member might be: I've had people on staff before that when they first started YEARS prior were a handful, but eventually settled down and became productive members who never got in trouble again; but, if they've recently been in trouble (the time frame is up to you, mine is the last year because I'm not so forgiving) then I wouldn't consider them.

[Tumbleweed]

HARP,
Just to let you know I locked your other thread as it was a duplicate of this. I'm sure that was just a mistake.

[HARP]

Aug 2, 2017 23:59:59 GMT -8 Tumbleweed said:

HARP ,
Just to let you know I locked your other thread as it was a duplicate of this. I'm sure that was just a mistake.

Shoot thanks. I have no idea how that happened I must have lagged or something! Thank you.

[HARP]

Kami

Thank you for your thorough advice!

My main issue is writing rules and such without spelling and grammar errors, but i did manage to find a interested member willing to go through them and send me corrected versions with the edits highlighted.

Another is coming up with a site plot, but some members might be ok with a dynamic world that depends on their actions and sub plots to build the world's story. I'm more of a mechanics and coder type of person. But asking interested members for advice and ideas seems to be working out.

Being in a bad staff community before, and experiencing poor staff management on other sites really just has me worried. But you guys are right. I just need to take my time to get to know people interested in staff positions to know why they want it in the first place and how they will handle the role.

I do wonder though. What is your opinions on staff to member communication. What is too much vs too little? Is having staff specific rules public too much? Is informing them when their report request is being looked into too much? Is asking for a vote for a feature addition too much?

If i should make a new thread for this let me know.

[Kami]

I think this thread is fine, it's a natural continuation of your original topic. If a mod disagrees, though, they'll chime in.

- I think asking members for their input when you're just getting started is A-OK. They don't need to be staff to do it, and it shows them that you as an admin are willing to listen to creative input (though, be sure to know when to draw the line: the site is ultimately yours, and not all ideas may match what you want the outcome to be, so don't feel obligated to take a suggestion).

What is your opinions on staff to member communication.

For the most part I think staff to member communications should be open, clear, and friendly. Not so friendly so as the lines between staff and member are blurred to the point that they no longer take you seriously, but enough so that members don't feel too intimidated approaching you (I say "too intimidated", because there's no way to get rid of it 100% in a relationship dynamic like this).

That said, "open" doesn't mean 100% transparent. Not every decision needs to be spelled out in excruciating detail, not every staff choice needs to be debated by members, members don't necessarily need to know what disciplinary actions have been taken, and so on. Unless you're crowdsourcing (eg: "What do you guys think of X idea" or "What should happen next?") then by and large a simple acknowledgement of the issue + thank you for bringing it to our attention + we've handled it should suffice.

What I also tend to do is if something happens (say someone does an extreme rule violation) is I will message them privately and handle it however it needs (whether through a ban, or whatever) and then post a public announcement naming no names, reminding all members of X rule and that it needs to be followed + the consequences of not following that rule.


What is too much vs too little?

Whoops I think I answered that. But overall: members don't need to know everything, but they need to know that their input is valued. Thank them for their time, acknowledge the issue, and let them know it's being taken care of.

Is having staff specific rules public too much?

Absolutely. Members don't need to know the ins and outs of forum moderation. Some transparency is good (eg: if you're reviewing profiles it's good to let them know what they can expect to see), but too much is ... well too much (eg: reviewing profiles, you don't need to let them know about how you track who's done what or how you choose which person is going to review a profile or anything that would be classified as "internal" information).

Is informing them when their report request is being looked into too much?

No, I think that's good! Like I said, I don't think they need to know every little detail about your decisions, but if something is reported, thank them + acknowledge the issue + let them know you're handling it. You may want to follow up with a confirmation that it's been handled (the level of detail, I think, use your best judgement on how much needs to be said).

Is asking for a vote for a feature addition too much?

It... it depends. Personally, I think voting for features is silly. If I want to try something, I'll consult with the other staff members and implement it if we agree in majority (eg a 3 out of 5 vote). If it sees use, then we keep using it (and maybe ask for feedback on how to improve said feature). If it doesn't, then it gets removed.

That said, for other forums this works. I just personally feel like what the forum contains should be decided by the administration, not the members, because they're not the ones that will have to deal with the problems that may arise from a new feature.

[HARP]

Kami

Understood. Thank you I really appreciate your detailed answers!

I just recall being a Mod years ago and there were no Mod and Admin rules to follow so I felt stuck. They kept saying use your best judgement so I did by going through the neglected reports after I was granted permission to go through them. Went through them all even the month old ones by messaging each member that reported that their report has been looked at. I never said what I did unless it was a simple "please delete or move this mistake thread" when it was an obvious mistake and made the board look cluttered. The admins were fine and happy I was actually going through the reports but did not like that I notified the members that reported when it was being looked into. Didn't make bigger decisions on my own like giving warnings, I took those up with the head admin since there was no mod chat to discuss them in. But did message the members "Thank you for your report, we will discuss the matter and make a decision." I ended up getting yelled at for letting members know when something was being looked into, so I was unsure if that really was a bad thing to do or not.
The forum vanished some weeks after I was demoted for being too open. But that's not the point.

The overall experience was overwhelming and confusing so would like to avoid repeating that.

Feel it would be best to write some Mod and Admin rules in the hidden Mod section based on what I have read in these boards. Thanks again!

[Kami]

I don't disagree with having mod-specific rules! I also have some staff-specific rules for various aspects of forum running. But as you stated -- it's not necessary to have it public (ie open to members (and possibly guests)).

And as for your prior experience, I think that whomever was the admin on that forum was being unreasonable. If they're not going to have a guideline for how procedure goes, I'm not really certain why they'd get upset for you using your best judgement. And I know that members like at least SOME transparency -- maybe some people want more than is really necessary, but overall there's no harm in letting a user know that you're looking into something. Being open about that, without divulging unnecessary detail, will foster trust between you and your members: they'll know they can come to you and, regardless of outcome, that you will take them seriously and take the time to let them know that you're looking into the situation / have dealt with it somehow.

[Eloell]

I am going to be repetitive because I think Kami hit this on the head.

Spare yourself the trouble of hiring strangers. If I were you I'd do my very best on my own for the first 2 - 3 months of my site. Once you have a handful of members observe them. Who is invested? Who is involved--both on the cbox and IC? Who is polite/kind to other members?

Skills are certainly important, but if you hire a crappy admin/mod who scares people away then no amount of pretty pictures is going to make your site successful.

And on the topic of admin/mods...if I were you I would only hire mods. Things get messy with multiple admins. You mentioned a bad experience...well the sad reality is that if you put together your entire site by yourself...you will likely start to feel the same way as the admin (my opinion matters more, it's my site), ESPECIALLY if you happen to hire a very opinionated admin. I'd keep yourself in a single category of ultimate power, and then delegate as people join your team.

The best mods are long-time RP friends. Do you have anyone from an old site you know well that you can reach out to? Or even an IRL friend? I've never done an application, I always just judge their involvement and character. Again, huge red flag is the unfriendly RPer...specifically the over-invested passive-aggressive kind who cry IRL when things don't go their way and then act very short in PMs/chats.

Best of luck!

[HARP]

Eloell

Thank you!

I actually just thought of that last night and messaged someone who I have rped with before and am friends with and I know is amazing at DMing and making plots! (plus is very friendly and not rude to others especially when explaining things.)

So hopefully he responds and we can get some plot made. I am not a very good story teller. I can make mechanics and code and too all the math, but when it comes to writing or story building, i'm in the garbage.

But if he says he can't I'll just do my best to make something to get the ball rolling once all the math is figured out.

Thank you c:

[Pebbles]

A lot of forum owners using jcink and proboards put up a staff search at specific places often enough and then end up hiring total strangers.....
i don't understand why.... because a lot of the times you will end up with people that are not ''trustworthy'' when it comes to being dedicated etc (cause all they want is the title on your new forum)

like i think has been said above, hire people that you got on your forum and get to know them a bit
If no one seems to be dedicated to your forum , not even a little, i do not recommend hiring anybody really
then just try to do the stuff on your own
unless you want to take the risk of hiring a complete stranger lol but i have been there done that.... never doing that again

on my forum, i was doing all of it by myself for months until i finally got 1 person being interested to become a mod lol
i just don't trust people that easily , for good reasons, so yeah - it was a lot of work on my own but at least i was sure no one was going to mess with the place

(i know members on your forum are also still strangers but at least then not as much, because you already know them a bit and their behaviour etc)

[bearsmummy]

I would love to chime in if I may. I have been around forums for about 14 years. I have run a couple of extremely successful forums. My forums have not been for RPG; however, a forum is a forum.

One of my largest peeves with running a forum is somebody who will request to be Staff withing hours or days of joining your forum.  In my opinion, these people just want to be in the spotlight.  I have noticed that these people tend to members of a number of forums and just about on every forum, they are staff.  These people think that because they are members on different forums, that they should be staff on every forum that they have joined.

I like to see how these people interact on other forums.  One key factor that I notice is that they have little to no imagination.  They will post the exact same post on every forum that they frequent.  Obviously, when that is being done, there is no "quality" or substance being shared.  I tend to shy away from such people.

I like Kami's comment regarding an application.  That is an excellent idea that I may use on my own in the future.

One thing that I did when I had my last forum was to allocate a section on the forum which was for staff only.  I kept it invisible to regular members.  In that Staff section, I had boards for sign ins, staff announcements, suggestions and ideas, etc.  This way, the comings and goings and workings of the forum was for Staff only.  The members did not need to know how things were being done.

Harp, I do hope that you will spend some time exploring your forum.  Get to know it.  If you need help, come to the Support forum.  When your forum becomes busier, then you can start bringing in the help.  This way also, you will be the one who knows your forum best - which is the way that it should be. 

Good luck on your new forum!