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Post by viruszero on Jun 30, 2008 15:58:13 GMT -8
No, but people can treat you different in regards to it.
I know it's juvenile, but some people still treat others different based on sex. I've seen it quite a few times on forums.
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Post by Candice on Jun 30, 2008 15:58:56 GMT -8
No, but people can treat you different in regards to it. I know it's juvenile, but some people still treat others different based on sex. I've seen it quite a few times on forums. So? Anyone that does that needs to grow up. And anyone that worries about their gender, can hide it.
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Post by Jesusfreak on Jun 30, 2008 16:05:47 GMT -8
Hi, The need to add your gender has been added for a number of reasons. In the main, it's in preparation for our next version, where we, and you can customise messages gender specifically. For example, we can have a message, say, in my profile, it can say view his most recent posts instead of the view recent posts by this member. The former, i'm sure you will agree, is more 'friendlier'. Craig Why not have it so that if it's not specified it says, "their..."
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Post by viruszero on Jun 30, 2008 16:07:40 GMT -8
I know, it is just easier not to have to select the option and then go through the hassles about it later. Though it's thankful they did include the hide code... Albeit after a bit of questioning and asking for the option. It still would have been better if they didn't touch what wasn't broken and didn't need fixing. I'm still steadfastly sure that for the extra time they spent they could have merely build up from what exists into what they want without the necessary removal of the undisclosed.
Pardon me, I got a bit sidetracked... But regardless, you can tell someone to grow up all you want, but if they're juvenile and insecure enough to be judging by gender, then most likely your, my or anyone's chances of convincing them of anything are slim and non-existant.
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Post by moongaze on Jun 30, 2008 16:09:18 GMT -8
Well, to help matters along Craig: "All required fields are marked with an asterisk" You need to add the asterisk to the Gender portion, which is a "required" option in the "Personal Information." Then again, it is kinda silly to have "personal" information which is typically thought of as "to be disclosed at-will" on the internet ... be required. And I think, that you are too focused on Political Correctness. I don't see why it's that big a deal. Legal documents have no 'undisclosed' option - you are either genetically male, or genetically female. This is not a legal document. More the reason why there should be an "undisclosed" option. If I want to push for a more politically correct way of things, I would suggest the option saying "Gender associated with." Or, maybe letting the board admins create NEW gender types per board (in which "non-disclosed" could be created and the specific gender phrases could be defined, which it sounds like we'll be able to do with "male" and "female" coming soon).
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Post by Thanatos on Jun 30, 2008 16:12:22 GMT -8
The term gender is widely used by gender theorists and transgendered peoples to mean the cultural gender that the person identifies with regardless of their physical sex. This change would at least make a little sense if they had asked what the person's physical sex was, but instead they force people to identify as male or female. What then for people who identify as gender neutral, genderqueer, transgendered, third-gendered, or any other sort of non-cisgendered person. Sex is physical, gender is cultural. Sex generally includes male, female, and sometimes intersex. Gender has tons of variations because it is a cultural construct designed to give a specific value, personality, or pattern to something that is relatively meaningless. I added a code to my forum which added the gender options 'No, thanks.', 'Genderqueer', and 'Transgender'. This new code has precluded the ability to select any of these genders and made the code which I spent a long time implementing completely useless. I personally was rather distressed upon signing into my forum only to be confronted with a message forcing me to choose a gender when I truly feel no affiliation to one. If you are trying to make it more friendly, why not make it friendly to EVERYONE. Adding a genderless or N/A option would be greatly appreciated.
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Post by Jesusfreak on Jun 30, 2008 16:16:45 GMT -8
Hahaha, now we're getting WAY out there...lol. Might as well ask for sex then. :-P
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Post by lyndaoh on Jun 30, 2008 16:25:09 GMT -8
I just checked my profile and you can hide it already.
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Post by moongaze on Jun 30, 2008 16:27:10 GMT -8
Well, to help matters along Craig: "All required fields are marked with an asterisk" You might need to add the asterisk to the Gender portion, which is a "required" option in the "Personal Information." Then again, it is kinda silly to have "personal" information which is typically thought of as "to be disclosed at-will" on the internet ... be required. And I think, that you are too focused on Political Correctness. I don't see why it's that big a deal. Legal documents have no 'undisclosed' option - you are either genetically male, or genetically female. For one, you probably dont see it as a big deal since it doesn't affect you. To ignore an issue and think it doesn't exist, or to say it's small and is of no consequence just furthers to alienate people. Sexual orientation has evolved over time so that there are more options than the "accepted by the mass of society" (mainly, straight) standards. Gender has had some changes as well and to ignore them or the people involved is, I feel, pretty bad. Until today, the gender option wasn't required as male or female, but now it is. If there is going to be requirements, they should be encompassing everything, and an "other/un-disclosed" option would be great to cover the rest who are not male or female (either by biological or social standards). Also, like you said, legal documents state "male" or "female" and I can understand that, especially if it is used to identify you physically. But other documents for data research will often have "other," "un-specified," or "non-disclosed" added, as it's only for data or survey purposes. This is not a legal document. This is more of a survey or data building question. By stating if I am male or female should not matter, since this is an online message board where gender should not matter. More the reason why there should be an "undisclosed" option. If I want to push for a more politically correct way of things, I would suggest the option saying "Gender associated with." Or, maybe letting the board admins create NEW gender types per board (in which "non-disclosed" could be created and the specific gender phrases could be defined, which it sounds like we'll be able to do with "male" and "female" coming soon). Age requirements make sense, as some content is not suitable for some ages. But unless you plan to make message boards deny users of certain genders, having it as a requirement is kinda strange. Sure, for the coding purposes as outlined in Craig's original post, it makes since for "his" and "her" post things. But with the option to "hide" this information as well, we're back to where we started before with male, female, and non-disclosed ... but now, you have to pick male OR female, and if you want non-disclosed, you have the check a box. The code will recognize "male" and "female" and act accordingly, and if that box is checked, it will ignore the male and female choices. Why not just let "other/non-disclosed" do the same thing and get rid of the box? Thanatos: I agree with you, whole heartedly. I am male, I associate as male, everything about me is male, and I am also straight ... but changing our profiles to require male or female bothered me because of friends I have who identify different than their sex insists and various other reasons
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Post by Kami on Jun 30, 2008 16:51:26 GMT -8
I just want to say something, and then I'll stop posting in this thread. I don't understand why this is a big deal. Yes, I understand that it may present a conundrum for those who don't affiliate with one gender or another. But, the fact remains that you can fill it out, and then hide it. It's not all that much more effort.
If you can't pick a gender, then your selection of male or female doesn't matter anyway, because you are going to hide it. Right? So, if you are a person who doesn't feel like either gender, or feels the opposite gender, either (A) pick the opposite gender, or (B) pick whatever gender and hide your choice.
I don't think that this is a big issue, and you might think that I'm being intolerant, or ignorant, but I'm fully aware that this is a big deal for some people, and I am sympathetic. I just see that there are other solutions to this issue, and I don't think that this thread needed four pages.
I see people here just looking at this as a problem, and arguing, arguing their point; instead, they could just accept that it's here, and it's not changing, and finding a way to work around it.
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Post by Peggy on Jun 30, 2008 18:30:27 GMT -8
What I want to know is, if a person hides his/her gender, won't it become obvious once the "view his/her most recent posts" starts appearing?
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Post by Kami on Jun 30, 2008 18:33:23 GMT -8
What I want to know is, if a person hids his/her gender, won't it become obvious once the "view his/her most recent posts" starts appearing? Nope. If you read some of Craig's previous posts, you'll see that if they select to hide their gender, the he/she, his/her will be overridden to 'their'.
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Post by Peggy on Jun 30, 2008 18:38:58 GMT -8
What I want to know is, if a person hides his/her gender, won't it become obvious once the "view his/her most recent posts" starts appearing? Nope. If you read some of Craig's previous posts, you'll see that if they select to hide their gender, the he/she, his/her will be overridden to 'their'. I read the thread, I guess I missed that part. Thanks.
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Kami
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Post by Kami on Jun 30, 2008 18:41:46 GMT -8
Nope. If you read some of Craig's previous posts, you'll see that if they select to hide their gender, the he/she, his/her will be overridden to 'their'. I read the thread, I guess I missed that part. Thanks. No worries.
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Nequam
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Post by Nequam on Jul 1, 2008 2:50:59 GMT -8
Ahhhh so it's ad related, so'k with me as long the feminine hygiene product ads don't get outta hand... I have been playing with the 'more gender options' code, will that no longer work? I have been enjoying making the icons... ~Nequam~
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