Mass deletion of posts on request - possible to prevent?

[Star's Legacy]

Apr 2, 2016 14:31:49 GMT -8 Barkley said:

Apr 2, 2016 14:25:58 GMT -8 Star's Legacy said:

You don't have to be rude to someone offering potentially helpful advice. You presented your issues and concerns and they presented a possible solution to your problem.

I'm not being rude at all.
I find the fact that you are insinuating that I am offensive.

I don't know anyone who would enjoy someone thinking that they should be 'tarred and feathered' because they made a simple comment.

[T.C.]

The thread was headed in this direction. Not towards an insult war.

Thanks for your feedback. A lot of the questions you are asking (e.g. about "ownership") and what not are legal issues as covered in our Terms of Service (I'm not going to go into the legal aspects any more, as I feel my last post covered that). However this main issue at hand isn't a legal issue, it's more of a moral one. One that we are open to community feedback on, and we appreciate your comments. Other members are welcome to chime in as well and let us know what their feelings on the matter are.

[Barkley]

Apr 2, 2016 14:34:02 GMT -8 ₪» ⅀ ƪ Ƒ «₪ said:

How.. is that.. not rude? lol

Well, I try my best.
My intention is never to be rude. I'm just honest. 

[Barkley]

Apr 2, 2016 14:34:16 GMT -8 Star's Legacy said:

Apr 2, 2016 14:31:49 GMT -8 Barkley said:

I'm not being rude at all.
I find the fact that you are insinuating that I am offensive.

I don't know anyone who would enjoy someone thinking that they should be 'tarred and feathered' because they made a simple comment.

It was meant in humour.
Too many people on this board take it upon themselves to tell others to join forums.net, which I find inappropriate, so I tend not to enjoy that kind of comment. NEVER tell another admin to leave Proboards.

[Former Member]

Throwin' my 2-cents in here. I see a lot of how this affects the forum, and for good forums and forum owners this is a real concern. I've also seen the flip side of this on forums with a crappy owner and mods, that get all power trippy on some members, gang up on them, threaten to share or misuse a member's posts or information, or worse. It gets all clicky like I'm back in high school or some dookie. I don't blame members for wanting to get the hell of out dodge in cases like this, and if they get banned or disabled or such, then what recourse do they have to protect themselves?

Just sayin there's always more than one side to the story. Proboards probably has to take a lot of guff for their stance on this issue. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes, but overall I trust their decision. All in all they do a pretty decent job of balancing their rights, the forum owners' rights and the members' rights. Not an easy task. And they still deliver an awesome product that don't cost me a dime. Kudos to you VS Admin !

[♥ ℒʊ√ ♥]

Throwing in my two cents, I have no problem with members requesting their posts be deleted. I would want the same privilege, as well.

It is/was their contribution to our forum, and if they no longer want those contributions to be a part of the forum, that's their decision.

We've had folks do this through our seven years, and it's never caused a problem.

As far as continuity, there's nothing that's being posted that is so vital to anyone's existence on our forum, that it will cause an issue if it's no longer available.

I appreciate and value our members and their choices are theirs, and theirs alone.

As the years go by, jobs, careers, professions change. Some may choose to have this part of their internet life gone with those changes.

Life does move on and attitudes change.

[Barkley]

Apr 2, 2016 15:12:40 GMT -8 ♥ ℒʊ√ ♥ said:

Throwing in my two cents, I have no problem with members requesting their posts be deleted. I would want the same privilege, as well.

It is/was their contribution to our forum, and if they no longer want those contributions to be a part of the forum, that's their decision.

We've had folks do this through our seven years, and it's never caused a problem.

As far as continuity, there's nothing that's being posted that is so vital to anyone's existence on our forum, that it will cause an issue if it's no longer available.

I appreciate and value our members and their choices are theirs, and theirs alone.

As the years go by, jobs, careers, professions change. Some may choose to have this part of their internet life gone with those changes.

Life does move on and attitudes change.

I'm sure you'll agree that every individual case is different, and that requesting mass deletion should be a case of common sense, that must go through a proper investigated course of action, rather than a guaranteed response?

Bear in mind that there are 5 million Proboards forums, so we're not likely to put it to a vote here, but as much as we all have our individual opinion, the bottom line is that it 'can' be devastating for one forum, and not so important for another.

I personally think if you write something on the Internet, you have a choice whether to submit, edit, or delete it at the time of posting. Deciding after a few thousand posts that you no longer want your posts on that forum, is unnacceptable.

Do we have the option in life to rewind and edit, or unsay something that we have said? Can we remove all the texts we've ever sent, or the letters, or perhaps every conversation we ever had with people?

[Barkley]

Apr 2, 2016 14:49:38 GMT -8 @rexracer said:

Throwin' my 2-cents in here. I see a lot of how this affects the forum, and for good forums and forum owners this is a real concern. I've also seen the flip side of this on forums with a crappy owner and mods, that get all power trippy on some members, gang up on them, threaten to share or misuse a member's posts or information, or worse. It gets all clicky like I'm back in high school or some dookie. I don't blame members for wanting to get the hell of out dodge in cases like this, and if they get banned or disabled or such, then what recourse do they have to protect themselves?

Just sayin there's always more than one side to the story. Proboards probably has to take a lot of guff for their stance on this issue. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes, but overall I trust their decision. All in all they do a pretty decent job of balancing their rights, the forum owners' rights and the members' rights. Not an easy task. And they still deliver an awesome product that don't cost me a dime. Kudos to you VS Admin !

My guess is you are in disguise. 

[T.C.]

10. FORUM CONTROL; MEMBER DISPUTES

ProBoards does not control the forums made available by means of the Website and Services. Forum administrators and moderators reserve the right, in their sole discretion, to delete or modify forum posts, revoke membership to the forum, block access to the forum, modify Your account profile, or modify any User Content (as defined in Section 15 below) on the forum. You should contact the forum administrator directly with any complaint, grievance or problem. ProBoards reserves the right, but disclaims any perceived, implied or actual duty, to monitor disputes between Website members. You agree to hold ProBoards harmless in connection with any dispute or claim You make against any other member. 

Proboards staff mass deleting conflicts with the bold above.

[Former Member]

can i throw my 2 cents in ? im from china so is yen ok ?

[Former Member]

Apr 2, 2016 15:27:51 GMT -8 Barkley said:

Apr 2, 2016 14:49:38 GMT -8 @rexracer said:

Throwin' my 2-cents in here. I see a lot of how this affects the forum, and for good forums and forum owners this is a real concern. I've also seen the flip side of this on forums with a crappy owner and mods, that get all power trippy on some members, gang up on them, threaten to share or misuse a member's posts or information, or worse. It gets all clicky like I'm back in high school or some dookie. I don't blame members for wanting to get the hell of out dodge in cases like this, and if they get banned or disabled or such, then what recourse do they have to protect themselves?

Just sayin there's always more than one side to the story. Proboards probably has to take a lot of guff for their stance on this issue. I wouldn't want to be in their shoes, but overall I trust their decision. All in all they do a pretty decent job of balancing their rights, the forum owners' rights and the members' rights. Not an easy task. And they still deliver an awesome product that don't cost me a dime. Kudos to you VS Admin !

My guess is you are in disguise. 

yep

[♥ ℒʊ√ ♥]

Barkley , although I do understand some admins may not agree that the member should always have the choice to delete, I do think the member's decision is the most important one over that of the admin.

A forum is only successful because of the members. It is they who make the community thrive. It is they who take the time from their lives to contribute to an admin's board.

As admins, we should appreciate that a member has chosen our community out of the millions out there to help make our creations a living, breathing reality. 

So why should any admin then turn on that member when the time comes to part ways and they may choose deleting their posts as a part of ending the relationship?

It's great if they don't, but understandable if they do.

We do not own their words, their photographs, their intellectual property. They belong to the member alone.

And thankfully, we have a host that does allow an admin the freedom to own the content, but that freedom comes with a price, as it should. 

[Lynx]

I can see both sides of the coin.

Yes - allow mass delete:

The content on ProBoards forums belongs to the member who posted it. So on this side of the coin, I can easily agree that this should be that member's right to request a mass deletion. Yes, people's mind can change overnight and maybe wish they hadn't asked for that the day before, but it is still their decision. That fault would be with the member for not stopping and asking themselves - before requesting the mass delete - if this is really what they want. Anger and frustration are well-known factors in having people say or do things that they normally would not say or do with a calm, clear mind. In this case, they are the ones who have to live with that decision as well.


No - don't allow mass delete:

I can also easily agree that this can be disruptive to forums. Most particular, but not certainly the only type, would be RP forums - where a mass delete request can really throw a wrench in an RP thread. Things are no longer there in a continuing fashion and can even break the sense from one post to the next when there used to be one in between that maybe tied the 2 posts together. In some cases, those threads may even have to be trashed becomes the thread no longer has continuity and / or sense to it. As such, this could cause unrest with other members who may have spent time with those posts just to have that work "disappear" now because of posts in the middle no longer there. It's almost, as some may see it, as now they have to start that hard work all over again. As such, this may lead to members becoming disgruntled and leave.

---

I think the biggest issue here, and maybe Mr. Clinger might agree, is to know where that "balance line" is for something like this. Arguments could be made indefinitely with people supporting one side or the other - and in the end, they'd all be right ... but where is that "balance line" that would be a satisfactory resolution for a majority of (because you're not going to be able to say all) members / owners? This, I think, is the most difficult aspect to find.

[Barkley]

Apr 2, 2016 15:42:35 GMT -8 ♥ ℒʊ√ ♥ said:

Barkley , although I do understand some admins may not agree that the member should always have the choice to delete, I do think the member's decision is the most important one over that of the admin.

A forum is only successful because of the members. It is they who make the community thrive. It is they who take the time from their lives to contribute to an admin's board.

As admins, we should appreciate that a member has chosen our community out of the millions out there to help make our creations a living, breathing reality. 

So why should any admin then turn on that member when the time comes to part ways and they may choose deleting their posts as a part of ending the relationship?

It's great if they don't, but understandable if they do.

We do not own their words, their photographs, their intellectual property. They belong to the member alone.

And thankfully, we have a host that does allow an admin the freedom to own the content, but that freedom comes with a price, as it should. 

I disagree.

If we build a house of cards, and one member decides to remove their card, the whole house can fall down.

When you post on a forum, you contribute to a community. Your contribution during your time on any forum often influences other replies, other debates, votes, and so on. It forms part of a conversation that leaves any conversation it was part of meaningless if it is removed.

Any member that does not intend on having their posts remain on the forum (I'm not talking about single post deletion requests) should not contribute to that forum in my opinion.

If there is a condition set by the admin, when joining a forum, that the member accepts, or does NOT accept, then it cuts out any problem here, so my idea that I wish to put to Patrick is for it to become a requirement of registration, that the user agrees to, or does not, upon registering.

That way, if they think they will want to remove their posts in the future, they press "I do not agree" and their registration process will be terminated.

Each admin can choose whether or not to have that clause, in the forum settings section.

This way, we don't have to have this debate, and the remedy suits 'everybody'.

[♥ ℒʊ√ ♥]

We join ProBoards AFTER agreeing to their ToS, so if one worries about a house of cards falling because of a member's right to remove their property, it is the admin's fault, not the member's. 

I don't think many members will choose to join a forum where they and their contributions are held hostage.

They'll just find one more amenable to their needs. There's a million of them out there.